High Tide Aquatics

Solar panel experts talk to me.

If you use a lot of power, and are in a sunny area, and have a flat-ish roof, and plan to stay there 7 years, then definitely worth it.
Otherwise ... depends.

But do not go to 0 usage. Just drop to Tier 1 at most.
 
I'm not sure if it's worth it anymore, I would say talk to a solar guy but their modus operandi is to simply sell you their product. The reason why I'm hesitant is because PG&E has pushed back against solar, and I believe new customers now MUST go into time of use scheduling which has the "peak" price point at something like 3-8 or 4-9 or whatever. Which unfortunately is not a big production time, and their off peak rates unfortunately fall at a time when you do create a lot.

However based on WHEN you use power it may be worth it, if you had a graph of the Apex power monitor or something and see that you use a lot of power during the day then you can make sure you stay as close to that first tier as possible. That MAY save you some money. You have to look into the federal rebate, I think the California one is all but gone though but that was tiny in comparison.
 
I'm not sure if it's worth it anymore, I would say talk to a solar guy but their modus operandi is to simply sell you their product. The reason why I'm hesitant is because PG&E has pushed back against solar, and I believe new customers now MUST go into time of use scheduling which has the "peak" price point at something like 3-8 or 4-9 or whatever. Which unfortunately is not a big production time, and their off peak rates unfortunately fall at a time when you do create a lot.

However based on WHEN you use power it may be worth it, if you had a graph of the Apex power monitor or something and see that you use a lot of power during the day then you can make sure you stay as close to that first tier as possible. That MAY save you some money. You have to look into the federal rebate, I think the California one is all but gone though but that was tiny in comparison.
This is not my experience. Combining PGE’s TOU rates with solar is a win for the consumer. It is what makes it so that you can produce the equivalent of only 80% of the power you use, at times convenient for your system, use power 24/7 whenever you need it, and still approximately zero out your bill (besides minor mandatory fees of course).

It is true the rates don’t match perfectly with solar production, but they are pretty close. They aren’t designed to match solar times, they are designed to match demand times.

They are even a bit more favorable if you also have an electric car, this is my TOU rate structure:

76aa74cb4b64fe29e206b70a0aa8a4ef.jpg
 
Well it most certainly is going to differ based on everyone's usages, i.e. an electric car you'd have regardless of the plan you have makes a huge difference.

But just looking at the EV rates, you're both blessed and cursed with an absolutely ginormous peak rate of about 52c /kWh, so if you do have a bias towards west facing panels and you don't use much electricity at night, you're great. Ditto for over night, where heaters more likely than not are going to be the main power user on a tank the off peak rates are a bit over 13c /kWh I mean hell I haven't seen rates that low in... crap I don't remember the last time. And more importantly the EV schedule doesn't have that stupid "baseline" aspect of it, so what you use is what you use, you aren't punished for "using too much" (fun fact the baseline is actually based on the average of 50-60% usage, so it's not like you're punished for using too much, you're punished if you don't squeeze your belt to half the size it should be!). Looks like your part peak rate is about the same as the 101-400% baseline rate for the E-1 (normal) schedule, so you really need to make a good chunk of net positive power during that peak time to really take advantage of it, which is probably going to be until 3-4pm at most, so if you come back from work and have your tank pop on for you to view, throw on the TV, make dinner using electric appliances you can get spanked pretty hard.

But my original comment was for general TOU rates, not the EV one. Where if you assume you won't hit the 400% rate (for the regular E-1 schedule) due to solar, you have a rate of 28c /kWh for 101-400%. where as with a TOU (E-6 schedule) off-peak rates over 100% baseline is over 27c /kWh so you don't even get much of a break at night. So there is no "hey I made more expensive power so I can save at night" argument. They just screw you from both sides.

Ultimately, anyone thinking solar should definitely do an energy audit, and not just how much you use per day on average which is what every solar company I talked to asked (run away if they only want to know what your monthly bill is), but WHEN you use your power. I know there's a bunch of third party dohickies you can clamp on your power meter that records usage (a bit more useful that a Kill-a-watt meter), or I'm sure there are companies out there that do the same. But you have to make darn certain when you use the power can be matched by making the power. IIRC John also has Powerwalls too? So he can use power he made during part-peak times during the peak time which helps out tremendously, basically making 27cent power and using it when it costs 52cents.

The big monkey wrench though is PG&E's greed... too many people do something they're likely to change it. This is why they were pushing so much solar (they get the Carbon credits I'm guessing), but now too many use it, and now new customers need to go to some ToU scheduling. Luckily I'm grandfathered in to my old rate plan for the life of the panels (25 years?) but that's going to get here sooner (I think I'm 10 years in? crap I really should look into that) than I like I'm sure and then I'll have to reconsider what to do. Hopefully battery technology costs will have dropped by then.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JVU
I’ve gotten several estimates from the power buying and leasing companies. It’s all a mug’s game I’m afraid. From programmed increases in power rates to the over-and-under tier penalties, it’s all very carefully rigged to benefit the house. I’m waiting until I can buy a ~1MW system outright for < $10k and then I’ll pull the trigger.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I’ve gotten several estimates from the power buying and leasing companies. It’s all a mug’s game I’m afraid. From programmed increases in power rates to the over-and-under tier penalties, it’s all very carefully rigged to benefit the house. I’m waiting until I can buy a ~1MW system outright for < $10k and then I’ll pull the trigger.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Here’s your 1 MW system:

eee42b091773484aa99f278f841c4610.jpg


Price is a bit higher than $10k, and where are you going to put it?

If those are your criteria for happiness, you’ll probably have to wait for cold fusion.
 
I still have my contractor's license in CA in addition to here in CO so I get periodic emails from the CSLB. This one pertains to solar. Nothing too ground breaking, just something you may want to know if you're looking to have solar done soon.


New Requirements for Solar Providers Take Effect September 30th
SACRAMENTO – The decision to go solar by adding a photovoltaic solar energy system can be an exciting but confusing one for homeowners. To help, the California Public Utilities Commission (CPUC) has issued new requirements for utilities that will impact CSLB-licensed solar providers. These requirements are designed to protect consumers and discourage contractors from using manipulative sales tactics.
Beginning September 30, 2019, solar providers of residential solar systems in certain regions of California will be required to upload a series of documents in a local utility’s interconnection portal after executing a solar photovoltaic (PV) contract with the owner of a single-family residence:
  1. The first four pages and the last page of the CPUC’s Solar Consumer Protection Guide that are initialed and signed by the homeowner with a date that precedes or matches the contract execution date;
  2. A completed CSLB Solar Energy System Disclosure Document; and
  3. A copy of the executed contract for the installation of the solar system.
The documents must be uploaded if the homeowner is a customer of Pacific Gas & Electric (PG&E), Southern California Edison (SCE), or San Diego Gas & Electric (SDG&E). The utilities will require these documents to be uploaded during the application process. The utilities will also require the solar providers to enter a valid CSLB license.
Solar providers also should be aware that CPUC and the utilities will conduct spot audits and reviews of uploaded documents.
For contracts issued before September 30, 2019, solar providers do not have to upload these customer documents. Instead, they are required to upload the customer-signed and dated solar installation contract as proof that the contract execution was prior to September 30, 2019.
The new requirements involve contractors that install rooftop residential solar systems (or solar systems installed on a residential property) and carry at least one of the following CSLB license classifications:
  • "B" – General Building contractors are authorized to install solar energy systems within the definition of B&P Code section 7057, since a solar energy system constitutes the use of two unrelated building trades or crafts.
  • C-10 – Electrical contractors are authorized to perform any solar projects that generate, transmit, transform, or utilize electrical energy in any form for any purpose.
  • C-46 – Solar contractors install, modify, maintain, and repair thermal and photovoltaic solar energy systems. A licensee in this classification shall not undertake or perform building or construction trades, crafts or skills, except when required to install a thermal or photovoltaic solar energy system.
For more information on these new requirements, head to the CPUC’s solar guide website. If you’d like materials to help your customers be “solar smart” visit CSLB’s Solar Smart page.
# # #​
 
protect consumers and discourage contractors from using manipulative sales tactics.
Strange it doesn't mention how this is being done? What are the manipulative sales tactics? how does it protect consumers when a company can just as easily close up shop and a LLC will protect said owner after he bails.
 
Back
Top