Neptune Aquatics

1.8x concentrated Soda Ash to match Triton Core7

JVU

President
BOD
I use Triton Core7, but my tank uses more of the Alk than the other components. So I wind up sometimes running just the soda ash without the others, or more soda ash than the others, but either approach uses up the Alk component faster than the others. Unfortunately you can’t buy just the Alk component.

So instead I just switch over to dosing only BRS soda ash when the Ca starts rising, and then switch back to Core7 when it’s in range again a few days later. One problem with this approach is that the BRS instructions (based on RHF’s recipes) are way more dilute than Core7, so I have modify the dosing amounts up and down when I switch them, which is annoying.

So instead I set out to figure out how to make a soda ash solution with BRS material to match the alkalinity of the Core7 component, 9750 dKH (= 3482 meq/L). After some sleuthing and some math I determined the Core7 recipe is about 1.8 times as concentrated as the BRS recipe. I was concerned that it might not stay in solution at the higher concentration mostly because I figured there was a good reason why RHF didn’t make his recipes more concentrated. I found some superficial “Because I said so” type of discussion saying there were good reasons but no helpful details online in R2R.

The higher concentration works out to about 686 g/gallon (181 g/L) soda ash in RO water. Extrapolating from solubility curves for sodium carbonate (soda ash) shows that that concentration should be soluble at about 62F and warmer if my assumptions are correct. I made up a gallon of it, it went into solution easily at room temp and has stayed in solution fine for a week or so, so far. Of course it’s summer now and not getting below 62F, so we’ll see if it stays that way in the winter. I don’t know for sure that the Core7 alk component is just soda ash, they may have added something else for increased solubility like NaOH. But it behaves the same as the soda ash when I use it as far as pH effect etc, and didn’t come with any special warning labels like I would think would be required with NaOH.

I mostly just wanted to throw this out there since I couldn’t find anyone posting directly about it after quite a bit of searching online. I tried it and it works well.
 
I think it also depends what kind of sodium carbonate (e.g. the hydration state). Google says 164 g/L for anhydrous at 15C and 278 g/L for 27C, so you're likely about right for anhydrous sodium carbonate.
 
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So I kind of wonder, when the dosing pump initially pulls the solution into the tubing, how much that vacuum/pressure drop affects the the solubility. The concern is everything is dissolved in the container and then starts precipitating in the tube.
 
So I kind of wonder, when the dosing pump initially pulls the solution into the tubing, how much that vacuum/pressure drop affects the the solubility. The concern is everything is dissolved in the container and then starts precipitating in the tube.
I hadn’t thought of that. I don’t think pressure of the liquid significantly affects solubility for a non-volatile salt like sodium carbonate. At least not in the real-world pressure ranges we are talking about. Also I haven’t noticed it occurring.
 
When I ran DIY additives (using BRS chemicals) I always diluted it way down with RODI.
You add a ton of RODI for top off anyway, so no problem with extra water.
It made a big difference on crud in the tubing, and reduced the fun dendrites that grow on the end of the tube where it drips into the tank.
Of course, you need larger tanks to storage.
 
So I kind of wonder, when the dosing pump initially pulls the solution into the tubing, how much that vacuum/pressure drop affects the the solubility. The concern is everything is dissolved in the container and then starts precipitating in the tube.
I went and double checked. Pressure really only affects solubility in a gas, not a liquid. Liquids are (almost) incompressible.
 
So I kind of wonder, when the dosing pump initially pulls the solution into the tubing, how much that vacuum/pressure drop affects the the solubility. The concern is everything is dissolved in the container and then starts precipitating in the tube.
I think what happens often is that certain tubing types are prone to gas permeation or spalling, which can create microbubbles, shredded tubing, and better nucleation sites for precipitation of whatever liquid you're using. Platinum cured silicone is good as is pharmed for light sensitive stuff. No idea what companies are using for theirs but that's what I've used in the lab.
 
I think what happens often is that certain tubing types are prone to gas permeation or spalling, which can create microbubbles, shredded tubing, and better nucleation sites for precipitation of whatever liquid you're using. Platinum cured silicone is good as is pharmed for light sensitive stuff. No idea what companies are using for theirs but that's what I've used in the lab.
I had to look up “spalling” ha! Red Sea sells tubing to go with their dosing pump that is “Air resistant TPE” - they advertise it isn’t as permeable as silicone tubing so you get more reliable dosing. But platinum cured silicone? Is the idea the Pt tints the hose or does it have any other purpose?
 
I had to look up “spalling” ha! Red Sea sells tubing to go with their dosing pump that is “Air resistant TPE” - they advertise it isn’t as permeable as silicone tubing so you get more reliable dosing. But platinum cured silicone? Is the idea the Pt tints the hose or does it have any other purpose?
I'm pretty sure the curing helps it resist oxidation since we have tubing that's many years old and hasn't yellowed at all. It's pretty much standard in pharma or the medical device area, but it looks like normal silicone, semi clear. Still is semi gas permeable, but only is a problem if it sits for days

Red sea calling that other tubing a TPE is literally like saying plastic, cause it can be almost anything that's a thermoplastic elastomer! I'd assume they use the more expensive pharmed type opaque tubing in the pump head section with cheaper parts going into the dip lines.
 
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