Discussion in 'Equipment' started by Tenny, Dec 16, 2013.

  1. Tenny

    Tenny Supporting Member

    So after Rich's talk, I have come to the conclusion I really do need more flow. Although I am not sure exactly how I should go about it. Currently in my 30g cube, I have two Koralia's (one nano, one older big model) both pushing ~400gph. I have already bought a cheap 800gph pump that'll be here tomorrow to increase it in the short term.

    I'm now thinking about the long run, esp when I switch to my new tank (~50g, 40" wide, 16" depth). I am currently thinking either a WP-25 or two Sicce Voyager 2 (or 3's). I have a ReefKeeper Elite, and can easily throw them on wavemaker mode. I was thinking Sicce's because they (from my reading) are better at starting / stopping than most others. They are pretty well rated, and seem like they would fit the bill when put at opposite ends of the tank.

    I know the WP-25's have a much more "advanced" wave maker than the ReefKeeper. I could put a PWM dimmer to control the flow if it turns out to be too much.

    Really not sure if I should go in that direction or I should go with the Sicce's. I have two big worries with the more "advanced" wave maker on the WP's is the tank's are both rimless and I am running southdown sand (very fine for those that remember it).

    Any thoughts on them or suggestions (can't afford the Vortech's...)
  2. sfsuphysics

    sfsuphysics Supporting Member

    Sand is going to be the issue with tanks with a lot of flow, doesn't matter if it's the cheaper pumps or the really expensive Vortech pumps you still will have a challenge as undercurrents will want to drag that sand back towards the pump. So before you go the direction of a lot of flow you might want to think about if you really want sand in the tank. If you noticed Rich's tank he doesn't have sand in the display tank, and one thing he said that you should really take away from his talk "If you want your tank to look just like mine, then do what I say" even if it was a bit tongue in cheek.

    That said, I'm not a huge fan of "wavemakers" making it so water sloshes back and forth doesn't seem terrible effective to me, unless stuff in the water moves past the coral and goes elsewhere then it really isn't that useful. That said I don't recall ever seeing someone do the food test with that rocking motion, basically dumping some food in the tank that stays suspended (flake food is good for this) and seeing where exactly it goes, if it stays in one area without dissipating much then that's a fairly horrible flow method. Remember corals want their pee and poop to get away from them :D

    If you are set on oscillating flow, I would go with DC pumps and not AC pumps (which I think the Sicce ones are, correct me if I'm wrong), turning AC pumps on and off frequently is just asking for trouble. So my advice, go with the WP25 pump, if you're going to hook it up to a PWM dimmer maybe even a WP40 and you can always dial it back if it's too strong for whatever sized tank you go in the future (I wouldn't put an WP40 on a 30g tank though).

    Overall let your corals talk to you, do they look healthy? Are they growing fine? Then no reason to worry about increasing the flow. Flow shouldn't be some magic number like X number of tank volumes per hour turnover, but relative to what you got and where, if you had a tank the same size as Rich's you might not need as much flow initially, however when those corals start growing in they will block flow so that magic "X times per hour" becomes much more meaningless.
  3. rygh

    rygh Supporting Member

    +1 on the sand issue. That is a very limiting factor in flow.

    About the only AC pumps that handle on/off well are the Koralia Magnums.
    The big Magnum ones have an electronic soft start.

    No experience with WP-25, but the specs seem good.

    FWIW: I have an alternating gyre, using Magnum-7 powerheads.
    It switches each hour, except at night.
    I still get dead spots down between rocks, but corals seem to like it.
  4. Tenny

    Tenny Supporting Member

    The sand issue is certainly a major concern of mine. Especially with the fine sand... I'm even re-thinking this now.

    As it is now, I have very few SPS (the easy ones, Birdsnest, Stylphora ) and those are in direct path of a 425gph nano. The 30g currently has crushed corals for a "sand bed" and I don't get too much turbulence down there. I know the southdown is going to cause a problem. I wasn't planning on having a DSB, but enough to cover the bottom by about an inch.

    My current growth is pretty good to my knowledge. I know I overfeed, so the corals are pretty much bound to get food.

    The only reason I was thinking about the SICCE one's are I've read they are pretty good about starting and stopping, but it looks like I will just go the WP-25 route. I'm afraid the WP-40 even with a PWM will be too strong. From what I've read, you can only bring them down to 13v and they may still be too strong at that level for the rimless w/ fine sand. If I need more than one, I'll just buy two.

    Thanks for helping me out guys.
  5. bluprntguy

    bluprntguy Webmaster

    The Jabao WP-10's are out and move about 1,050 GPH for $61.50 and come with a controller. I might try one in my sump since I have a small forest of acros in there these days.

    I'm not sure it really ever makes sense to buy now for an upgrade you are planning later. Inevitably, when the upgrade actually happens there is going to be something newer and prettier (notice I didn't say "better") and you will just HAVE to have it. I think it's better to buy for the system that you have now and sell or trade if you upgrade. There is always someone looking to buy or sell equipment.
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2013
  6. sfsuphysics

    sfsuphysics Supporting Member

    Oh neat, they made the WP10 finally. I know there was talk about making one, neat to see it came out so quickly... one reason iPods/Pads/Phones are made in China, that close to the factories that make everything and you can come out with a new product in no time.

    I might do a couple of those WP10s on a 30g tank. Wish they had actual dimensions of the products though, the pictures are useful but without anything to compare to, I don't know if I'm buying a coke can sized pump (older Tunze streams) or a tiny little ball of love...er flow that fits in the palm of my hand :D
  7. Tenny

    Tenny Supporting Member

    I saw the WP-10's but they don't have magnetic bases which really frustrates me. Still haven't seen any reaching the states yet (on CL, or Ebay). Fish-Street is the only ones with them thus far.

    While I do talk about upgrading to my 50g, I am basically only waiting on polishing the glass and finishing the purchase of a few last things then I will be setting it up. I already have extra LR curing in another thank. So it's not a very distant upgrade... maybe 2-3 weeks.
  8. Tenny

    Tenny Supporting Member

    • Size - 5.2cm x 6.7cm
  9. bluprntguy

    bluprntguy Webmaster

    The text on the WP-10 says that they actually come with magnetic bases, but they haven't updated the photo yet. It's right below the part about how you should order from them because they are only an hour and a half away from the factory and work very closely together.
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2013
  10. zeroinverse

    zeroinverse Guest

    If anyone putting in a group buy, I may be interested in the WP60s. :)

    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  11. Tenny

    Tenny Supporting Member

    Heh, I was thinking about doing one possibly. If there's a lot of interest I would...
  12. sfsuphysics

    sfsuphysics Supporting Member

    you can get the WP25 & 40 from the NJ warehouse and shipping is just over $6 compared to 11-14 from overseas. Too bad they don't ship the WP60s from NJ
  13. Tenny

    Tenny Supporting Member

    Says they are opening a CA warehouse too!
  14. sfsuphysics

    sfsuphysics Supporting Member

    Yeah but then you need to pay sales taxes, besides you're not doing shipping for much cheaper than $6.
  15. Coral reefer

    Coral reefer President

    Might want a 60 or 2 as well...
  16. grizfyrfyter

    grizfyrfyter Reef Geek 3D Printed

    Someone in sac on another popular forum just did a GB of 25, 40 and 60 pumps and might have a couple extras. I can transport from sac to the bay if needed. I know the 25 is $57 and the 40 is $71 and I think the 60 is $90.
  17. grizfyrfyter

    grizfyrfyter Reef Geek 3D Printed

    If you aren't charged sales tax, you are liable to pay the "use tax" yourself and I believe that is going to start being enforced more often.
  18. Tenny

    Tenny Supporting Member

    I'd be interested in a 25 or two if there are any. Not sure which forum this was though, any direction to the person that ran it would be great.
  19. HiFidelity

    HiFidelity Guest

    hhmmm I've been thinking about getting 2 WP 25's for my new 45 gal tank.
    Best part is, people are already controlling them via Reef Angel
  20. sfsuphysics

    sfsuphysics Supporting Member

    Yeah, but who pays a "use tax". Good luck in enforcing it though, I mean sure the NSA is spying on everything we're doing now the IRS will too? :D There's a reason why they got Amazon to start collecting sales tax in California because they realize getting people to pay a "use tax" will be next to impossible to enforce.

    Out of curiosity any idea how many pumps were needed to be ordered to get that pricing? Looking at their website you can't get an WP25 for that cheap if you bought more than 40, and that assumes no shipping. I'd be interested in all those pumps at that price, where in the bay area can you transport them?

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