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Any gotchas in regards to a Kalk reservoir mixing pump?

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richiev

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Since everyone knows Kalk is the best dosing solution in both that short term and long term :), I continue using it very successfully in my frag tank. I'm debating setting up my display with Kalk too, especially now that I have lines running through my wall externally and can put a big reservoir outside.

I generally do not use a reactor, and just mix up a batch every time. My overall process is dump 10gal worth of Kalk powder into my reservoir, dump whatever amount of water in to fill it, dumping from a jug up high which serves as my mixing.

I've been running RO lines all over my house, so I'd like to now run one to my Kalk reservoir(s). However, filing that with a slow RO line means I need to mix it somehow, since pouring won't happen.

Hence the question, is there anything special I need to account for in a Kalk mixing pump? I'm more referring to if the Kalk will break down magnets or anything and cause issues; I am less worried about it getting gummed up since I can more easily detect that.

My plan will be:

1. periodically dump more Kalk mix in
2. enable my RO refill
3. Set a pump on a timer to run for about how long it takes to fill the reservoir
4. later turn off the RO refilling (maybe manually flip off the pump at that point)

Basically make things more complicated than I need to, replacing a dumping of Kalk + carrying a jug with a convoluted mixing setup :). However, if I end up switching my display to this setup, I'm going to try switching to a big Kalk reservoir where this will be more warranted (maybe a 30 gallon brute).
 
Kalk does eat up pumps by causing premature wear very quickly which is why most use a kalk reactor (kalk stirrer) when trying to dose higher concentration than fully saturated.
 
If I understand correctly, this is not a kalk reactor but a way to make still kalk. In that case, don’t use a pump, use a manual stirrer. I have a long plastic paddle that I stir with for a minute after adding water and kalk. You don’t want a pump mixing for an extended period of time as it fills with water. And if you dump the kalk in before the water is in, it won’t go into solution so you’ll just have granular kalk grinding through the pump.
 
Not the same but kinda, I maintain a couple water treatment plants for county bus washes. They use sodium hydroxide that is super saturated in ro water in the treatment process. To mix it there's a little motor above the tank that connects to a paddle that just constantly spins.

I believe during that last talk by @Thales he showed his kalk reservoir with a motor above it to do the mixing.
 
Srt4eric said:
Not the same but kinda, I maintain a couple water treatment plants for county bus washes. They use sodium hydroxide that is super saturated in ro water in the treatment process. To mix it there's a little motor above the tank that connects to a paddle that just constantly spins.

I believe during that last talk by @Thales he showed his kalk reservoir with a motor above it to do the mixing.
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Sodium hydroxide and calcium hydroxide are completely different with respect to stirring/mixing.

Rich was showing his kalk reactor, which is totally different from a still kalk reservoir.
 
@JVU : the mixing with a paddle by hand is what I'm seeing if I can avoid. That's equivalent to me by hand carrying jugs and dumping from high up to mix it, but less water carrying (just stir).

@Srt4eric : maybe the middle ground on what you and @JVU are saying is I figure out how to setup a paddle style stirrer on the reservoir. Effectively setup a really big reactor, but not do the constant stirring nor constant water drip.

But going back towards the basics, let's take as a given this will be hard on a standard powerhead or other pump. I have a bunch of those around, and can easily get them very cheap. In this situation, I'd also only be running the pump for about 10 minutes, once every two weeks'ish. It's not a constant mixing, reservoir, setup. It'd be similar to a saltwater mixing setup.

Would there be any likelihood that this is bad for the water itself? Ignoring if the pump would eventually die out. Would Kalk itself cause issues to the pump in a way that would cause it to hurt the water? Including if it chewing up the pump a bit would cause issues.

If it'd all work, but I'd just need to swap a $20 bottom of the line powerhead once a year I'd be ok with that.

@derek_SR it was my understanding in every modern & scientific country, such as the USA, it's well established that Kalk is very effective; if not ideal
 
Also as an added option, let's say I setup a really big reservoir at my house, for now define that as 30 gallons. I don't want to dose from a mega long line to my frag tank, since my worry would be it'd not be precise nor accurate over the 30ft of tubing I'd probably need.

If I kept a second reservoir at my frag tank, and pulled from my primary reservoir, would it be reasonable to assume that would be stable, following the "don't mix the Kalk and let it sit and it'll stay stable" idea?

I would do this by pulling water from near the bottom of the primary reservoir, and filling it into the secondary reservoir near the bottom as well. I would do it at a low fill rate, so that I wouldn't break the crust on the second reservoir. I would then run my standard peristaltic pump to dose.

Secondary reservoir(s): refill weekly and dose from them daily
Main reservoir: run like I'm trying to design above, refill monthly (or maybe even less frequently)

I think I have the needed pumps for this, and the equipment I could configure using home assistant and a couple esp32s and/or some smart outlets I have.
 
richiev said:
@JVU : the mixing with a paddle by hand is what I'm seeing if I can avoid. That's equivalent to me by hand carrying jugs and dumping from high up to mix it, but less water carrying (just stir).

@Srt4eric : maybe the middle ground on what you and @JVU are saying is I figure out how to setup a paddle style stirrer on the reservoir. Effectively setup a really big reactor, but not do the constant stirring nor constant water drip.

But going back towards the basics, let's take as a given this will be hard on a standard powerhead or other pump. I have a bunch of those around, and can easily get them very cheap. In this situation, I'd also only be running the pump for about 10 minutes, once every two weeks'ish. It's not a constant mixing, reservoir, setup. It'd be similar to a saltwater mixing setup.

Would there be any likelihood that this is bad for the water itself? Ignoring if the pump would eventually die out. Would Kalk itself cause issues to the pump in a way that would cause it to hurt the water? Including if it chewing up the pump a bit would cause issues.

If it'd all work, but I'd just need to swap a $20 bottom of the line powerhead once a year I'd be ok with that.

@derek_SR it was my understanding in every modern & scientific country, such as the USA, it's well established that Kalk is very effective; if not ideal
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The stirrer motor can go above the limewater container and spin an axle that goes down into it, with some zip ties on the end of the axle that goes in the water. That way the motor doesn't get ruined by the linewater. But replacing a crappy pump occasionally works too

I heard Rich on Reef Beef mention potentially using a cheap auger-style autofeeder to add kalk to the bucket, but I don't know if there was any follow up on that
 
I think they gotcha with the top level pump is it'll just take forever to mix, and wouldn't be as effective unless I'm constantly adding water.

Using my saltwater mixing analogy, I can't imagine how long it'd take to mix saltwater with a top mounted, paddle, pump. Unless it was crazy strong. Would be a hilarious video/contraption though.

I'm thinking a pump blasting the container into a white storm once a month as I refill.

What about those mp10 knock offs from jebao? Those aren't throw away pricing, but they have a lot less moving parts in the tank. My thought being don't put them near the very bottom, but put them near the bottom 1/3rd. It'd still get covered in residue, but I'd tie a bit of fishing line to it and every couple months (year?) could pull it out and give it a cleaning.
 
richiev said:
I think they gotcha with the top level pump is it'll just take forever to mix, and wouldn't be as effective unless I'm constantly adding water.

Using my saltwater mixing analogy, I can't imagine how long it'd take to mix saltwater with a top mounted, paddle, pump. Unless it was crazy strong. Would be a hilarious video/contraption though.

I'm thinking a pump blasting the container into a white storm once a month as I refill.

What about those mp10 knock offs from jebao? Those aren't throw away pricing, but they have a lot less moving parts in the tank.
Click to expand...
Oh - I meant with the shaft sticking all the way to the bottom. Behold: my extremely detailed technical drawing. Rectangle on top is the motor, its axle sticks through the lid, into the water, and mixes the stuff at the bottom

Screenshot 2025-01-21 at 12.42.19 AM.png



And if you want cheap pumps, don't go with the mp10 knockoffs which still cost a decent amount. Get an SOW-30 or something for what, $30-40? And it'll do the job just the same
 
tribbitt said:
Oh - I meant with the shaft sticking all the way to the bottom. Behold: my extremely detailed technical drawing. Rectangle on top is the motor, its axle sticks through the lid, into the water, and mixes the stuff at the bottom


View attachment 64998
Click to expand...
That I think is the standard reactor style mixer. My challenge is I'm not sure that would move enough water without a really big pump. However maybe I'm underestimating how much of a mix I could get if I let a pump run for an hour.

I'll check out AliExpress for a geared electric pump and see what I can come up with. The shaft could be anything (maybe an acrylic rod) and the propellers I could 3d print.

I'm also thinking through how could I create some automated Kalk powder adders. I'm imagining something like those old automated drum feeders where you add food to the little cells and it rotates. Whenever a new one goes over the opening it all falls out. I could probably do that too, but it'd be hard to keep it from gumming up and also keep it air tight enough to avoid the powder becoming weak by absorbing CO2.
 
Geo uses some pump in their Kalk reactor
www.geosreef.com

GEO KR618 Kalkwasser Reactor GEN3 | Geo's Reef

www.geosreef.com www.geosreef.com
I'm guessing that pump lasts in the Kalk environment.

I used a maxijet to circulate Kalk in a Rubbermaid tub 2x day for with the old mechanical timer, and the blue tunze osmolator pump to the aquarium. Both pumps lasted years. I don't think the current Maxi Jets are as good. Went away from that model for the last couple decades but recently switched back. I'm using the hydros ATO pump and a Nero three for circulation. Not sure how long those will last but it's what I had.
 
What was the jaboa pump telegraham (and others) was using while he was dosing limewater slurry? I seem to remember him keeping a counter going to track how long before it failed. I would think slurry would kill the pump quicker than saturated limewater but don't know.
 
Patio said:
What was the jaboa pump telegraham (and others) was using while he was dosing limewater slurry? I seem to remember him keeping a counter going to track how long before it failed. I would think slurry would kill the pump quicker than saturated limewater but don't know.
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This was a useful rabbit hole to go down. If I'm following this properly, the idea is this person has been, for a prolonged period, dumping a bunch of kalk into water to make a slurry, running a cheap jebao power head in it, and then dosing that straight. https://humble.fish/community/threads/dosing-kalkwasser-using-a-dosing-pump.5460/page-3

Honestly doesn't seem crazy to me. Easier than trying to get the perfect clear kalk the rest of us need otherwise our setups go whack.

I'm not ready to go that far yet, but seems like a sign my idea isn't totally crazy if I just use a pump to mix occasionally.

I'll set it up on my frag tank and give it a try.
 
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