Neptune Aquatics

Coral Dip Casualties and Questions

MolaMola

MolaMola

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So sad, all of my porcelain crabs (more than a dozen, favorite inverts in tank) have vanished and I think died after I dipped coral frags and put them in the tank last week. Saw a big brittle star eating what I thought was a molt of the largest one but now I think it was the whole crab. It has been six days so I know they are not hiding or molting and I need to get over it and make a new dip plan.

Story: Went to a frag swap and although the frags looked fine I decided to set up a dipping routine after a lot of research. Chose Bayer insecticide because Revive seemed harsh on LPS corals I dipped a month ago and read a lot of people think it is not very effective. After acclimating, went with a concentration of ~12ml/cup, ~10 min soak and frequent baster blasting. Did not want to skimp on the rinse, so rinsed each piece with tank water over sink, then swished and soaked, then another rinse tub, then another solo rinse, then into tank. Had done a water change to get a lot of water for this. Stuck down a few frags with superglue or epoxy putty.
The next day I didn't pay much attention to the inverts and in the afternoon I removed a few things for students to make some frags, then I mounted them in the tank with glue and putty. That is when I noticed no porcelain crabs fanning the water and the starfish with the big crab. I wanted to save what I thought was the molt to show students, but the starfish was wily and took off with it. Other inverts seem normal - brittle and serpent star, snails, hermits, mithrax crab, urchins, sea cucumber, peppermint shrimp, and also anemones.

Questions:
Sound like the Bayer took out the porcelain crabs?
Do you suspect it was in the water or from fumes, as my husband suggests? I was dipping about 5 feet away from the tank and never considered the air.
Not likely from glue or putty, right?
Possible that those crabs are hypersensitive compared to other creatures?
I will definitely try to get more but might wait until next fall.
Suggestions for future dip plan?
Was not interested in setting up a coral QT but does it sound necessary in this situation?
 
It sounds that way. How much did you rinse the coral after dipping? Ideally you setup a dipping container and then a larger rinse container you can soak the coral in post-dip.
 
Did not want to skimp on the rinse, so rinsed each piece solo with tank water over sink, then swished and soaked in a tub, then in another rinse tub, then another solo rinse over sink, then into tank. Don't think I could have rinsed more. That is why I was surprised the crabs died. Do not want to set up a coral QT but I wonder if it would help putting them in a heated container with flow overnight and no light before placing in tank. Then again, maybe it was airborne fumes that caused the problem. Makes me not want to dip.
 
I'd be surprised if it was the fumes because the concentration of the vapor would have to be very high for it to effect that volume of water and then only have it effect those crabs too.
 
Hmmm yeah I can't say I have any experience with Bayer. We do know that bayer is an INSECTICIDE, it is designed to kill terrestrial insects. Crabs being part of the same phylum as insects would suggest that there's a possibility remnant bayer killed them. But I highly doubt it. It sounds like these were small frags that were well rinsed. The amount of remnant bayer that would enter your tank must be so diluted by your over all tank volume (I want to say your tank is huge too!). But in the end I don't know, it could be the crabs are hyper sensitive to remnant bayer.

Molamola I can say I've dipped a LOT of LPS corals with Revive. If you're using the right amount as directed on the bottle, you should be totally fine.

If you notice LPS corals dying after dipping in revive, I highly suspect it is the frag and not the dip that killed them. Since you're only dipping for 10 minutes.

Often times people frag way too late, and they bring "fresh cut" frags to swaps. Or maybe the frags were sloppily made, example: fragging and glueing zoas with no attached substrate, fragging through a polyp instead of around.

Also some corals are especially sensitive. Could be they died coincidentally and not due to revive.


Revive Dip Ingredients
  • Oleum abietis (pine or fir oil) and Citrus Limon (lemon peel extract).

Bayer Insecticide Ingredients
 
Thanks for your responses, Flagg and Enderturtle.
Maybe I will try Revive again. I didn't have anything die from Revive but a symphillia and fungia looked unhappy after a dip in it. It was probably double acclimation stress because they had not been at the LFS long before I purchased them. I just thought from reading forums that if I were going to dip perhaps I would go for something stronger against pests but less irritating to corals than Revive ingredients.
Think I will inquire over at my live rock vendor forum on RC about porcelain crab sensitivity.
 
If you dip a leptoseris in revive or coral rx it will look close to dead. Just did this yesterday.

When I dipped my orange fungia, half of the color was gone and the flesh retracted into the skeleton during the dip. The mouth was gaped wide open.

A day in the tank and everything was fine and colored up again.

Corals do not like being dipped lol :)
 
Bayer works wonder. I've been using bayer to dip SPS for a few years now. However, it's not easy to clean off the bayer residuals on the corals. Even if you rinse the frags off like 5-6 times, there is always some left behind on the corals.
When the Bayer goes into the tank, it will kill pods, shrimps, star fish.......etc.
 
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One of my peppermint shrimps has reappeared plus two small porcelain crabs! Still sad and wondering what to do in the future. Since the disappearance of porcelains I have used Revive only. Considering setting up a small holding tank in the future so I can use Bayer then soak them longer in there but not wild about the idea of having another tank.
 
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