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Coral Problems--Zoas selectively open.

Gomer

Gomer

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Ok. I am at a loss to figure out what the deal is with my zoas.

Back history: My tank almost crashed a couple months ago from a high salinity issue (refractometer problem). My first sign was zoas not opening up for literally a few months (couldn't figure out what was wrong. Tank bleached one day and about then I figured out the salinity issue and brought it in check.

Now: Zoas still only open ~ 25% of the way for the past month or so. I started up a 10g frag tank a month ago and just tested it out with a zoa frag. Within 24hrs, it FULLY OPENED! So something is odd in my BC14 and I don't know what. The BC14 is about 1yr old and USED to be fine.
I did a lot of tests and the tanks are REALLY close

BC14 / 10g frag tank
Alk: 2, 2 meq/L
pH: 8.2, 8.2
Sal: 1.025, 1.025
T: 80°F, 80 °F
NO3: ~1, 0 ppm
NO2: 0, 0.05 ppm
NH4: 0, 0 ppm
PO4: 0, 0
Ca: 315, 325 ppm

As you can see, the parameters are fine and they are nearly identical that way.

Pests?
No nudis, pox, spiders etc on them.

Lighting?
The BC 14: has 1x24watt actinic, 1x24watt 50/50, 15watt Cree LEDs (which are REALLY bright).
10g frag: 2x36watt 6700K. These are old ~1-1.5yr bulbs from a freshwater tank

Fuge?
Both have a cheato fuge. the BC14 one is highly productive at growing cheato.

"Meds"?
The BC14 has Purgen, and Seagel (carbon/heavymetals) (replaced ~1month ago)
10g has nothing

Flow?
Upgraded pump in BC14 and hydor. 10g has an aquaclear 70 fuge.

Dosing?
BC14 has been getting 2-part dosing to keep up with Ca/Alk
They both also get ~10% WC weekly


So...everything looks fine. I can't see ANY flags on why the BC14 is having problems. Infact the 10g should have more problems.

The ONLY thing I can think of at this point, is some sort of chemical warfare with the corals.

Here is what is in the BC14. ANy red flag compatability things that would affect the zoas?

BC 14 Coral list:
A. prostrata
Ric Yuma
Zoas
Mushrooms
Acan lord
Leather Toadstools
Fungia plate
frogspawn
sand anenome


I just don't know what is wrong.
 
I've had zoas shrink when I ran too much carbon. Maybe try doing a massive water change and removing the carbon and Purigen.

The other thing that gives them probs is high salinity, so maybe triple check your readings.

Also in general, you might want to bring up your alk. It can affect zoa colors. 2 meq/L is pretty low.

Does the frogspawn put out any sweepers at night? Might be stinging the zoas?

What's a sand anemone? Majano?

Dip one of the colonies in tank water with some Povidone to double check for pests?

Hmmm... dunno what else.
 
The frog spawn is suprisingly friendly, unlike my old arcan echanata (spel?). I have the zoas in several places fairly isolated so it isn't anything like that.

The 2meq/l is low, but it is the same as my 10g where they open up.
I'll try the large water changes and see what happens when I remove the purgen/carbon.

I can't dip (don't have providone yet) but when when I can get some.

Someone ID'd the anemone as Phymanthus sp. Here is a pic
http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?act=attach&type=post&id=33315
 
Still no dice. Did a big water change and haven't had carbon or purgen in the tank for several days. The zoas that I put in the 10g that immediately opened up, are still opened happy today. I'm perplexed.
 
YES!! 4+ months....still couldn't figure out what was up.
I went as far as removing all my rocks + cleaned them, replace the sand, brand new cycle, 100% new water. Water tests like nobodys business and nothing. No dice. They just wouldn't open and things weren't happy in the tank.

Zoas that haven't opened in that long is a SAD SAD site. ..and I though I looked atrophied with my right leg after major surgery.

so, EILEEN!!!! YOU WIN THE UNIVERSE! Your skimmer saved me. 12hrs of running it and they are OPEN! My worry is, why didn't all the previous things take care of it?
 
[quote author=Gomer link=topic=2950.msg37159#msg37159 date=1205200118]
My worry is, why didn't all the previous things take care of it?
[/quote]Because you didn't have Eileen's skimmer...... ;D
 
Eileen's magic skimmer complete with magic dust coating (sorry Tony you had to clean it off).

Either that or you have my zoa mojo that Charles seems to think I have.
 
I hate this tank.

So, I had the skimmer on this tank for a week. Everything was perfect. I took the skimmer off, and the next day (and since...been a week+) everything has been closed up. The tank only had a small leather and some zoas (everything else is in my frag tank)

So what did the skimmer do.

1) removed proteins
2) added flow
3) added O2 to the water

With the almost zero bio load and the simmer running for a week, I would think that any "toxin" build up over 12 hrs would be trivial. So #1 SHOULD be out.

..so add flow. I added in a koralia 1 an I have plenty of flow. Still no dice. #2 is out.

..so add more "O2". I aimed the koralia to the surface creating even more surface/air interaction. Mind you this tank has an "overflow" water fall between chamber 1/2 already. I also opened up the tank lid. Still no dice.


so I don't know anymore. I have about had it with this tank. I see plenty of other biocube run with stock lighting, stock pump, closed lid, and all is well. I can't keep a damn zoa open unless I have a big skimmer on the front :(

Note: I can probably put the skimmer back on and witness the zoas starting to open within an hour....
 
[quote author=Gomer link=topic=2950.msg40012#msg40012 date=1207684876]
Note: I can probably put the skimmer back on and witness the zoas starting to open within an hour....[/quote]

Give it a try, I'd like to see what happens.
 
Let me rephrase.

My frag tank originally had an HOB refugium (AC70). I wanted to try out a skimmer to see if that would help my BC14. It did. I left it on for a while and all was happy. Since the BC14 had a tiny bioload, I moved it to the frag tank and moved the HOB fuge to the BC14. BC14 "instantly" got unhappy. Eventually, i swapped again and witnessed a rapid happiness response from the zoas. I cared more about my frag investment which had a big frag bioload so I moved it back to my frag tank and the BC14 went blaah overnight.

By my note, I mean that if I switched it over to the BC14 another time, I would anticipate it would be happy again right away.

I'll be returning the skimmer to Eileen this Saturday and getting another from Bryan (do you still have the lid in your van?). In that transition, I'll see about moving the skimmer to the BC14 on Friday when I get home from work and see how it responds. I'll take it off in the morning so I can give it back to Eileen all cleaned up.
 
[quote author=Gomer link=topic=2950.msg40015#msg40015 date=1207686932]
(do you still have the lid in your van?)[/quote]
Yep, I have it and I'll bring it to the meeting.
 
After a series of systematic tests, it turns out the O2 exchange was sucky enough to impact the tank. I'm running the tank open top now with a Sunpod
 
Interesting observation.
I have same issues with Zoas (palyzoa are doing great though).
I have a skimmer but it's in a sump. I have a canopy which may restrict air flow as well.
I was trying to compensate by having a pump blowing water through the surface.
 
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