Kessil

Fragging Zoas?

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Xavier510

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I’ve got a bunch of zoas that have been growing like crazy and I’ve been wanting to frag them for quite some time to add to DBTC. I’m fairly new at reefing and have never fragged zoas before, so what’s the best way at going at this? What I’ve read the best way is to get some bone cutters and try and cut pieces of rocks with polyps on them but my dilemma is that majority of them are mounted to a fairly large and somewhat flat rock. Some can still be pulled off the rock and the plug could be cut as they haven’t fully grown off the plug yet but, the next problem I run into is the polys being very close together. What would be the best way to frag? All suggestions and help is welcomed! Thanks
0e5149459371cef50d4448a5fda35510.jpg

Not the best pic but this majority of the zoas


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First off, zoas or palys since they can be hard to tell apart, know that palytoxin is real. 99% of the time, probably more, it’s a non issue, but the time it is an issue is memorable. So, safety glasses, gloves if you have cuts on your hands, don’t touch your eyes. Soap and water on your hands for cleanup.

All that said, fragging zoas is pretty easy. You can remove a chunk of rock from under them and glue that to a plug if you want, but it isn’t required. Simply scraping them off of the rock with a blade works too. Some people like wax carving sets, others like scalpels. I’ve done both of those, used bare razor blades, and even dull screwdrivers in a pinch.
Once you have the polyp(s) cut free, put a dot of super glue on a plug, pad the bottom of the zoa dry momentarily, and plop it down in the glue. Single polyps can be hard to get a grip on, but I find surface tension keeps them stuck to my fingertip. Be sure to put the correct side down (hint, not the head). It may sound silly, but with smaller ones like hornets it can be hard to tell when they are all closed up.
After this stick it back in the tank and be on your way to the next one. When I started I liked doing them in small groups, but as I got better I started doing them individually. Once the individuals start growing a couple new heads at their base I consider them healed and ready for someone else’s tank. This only takes a few weeks in good conditions. Obviously you could send them on right away, but I like to play it safe.
 
I play it safe and always wear a N95 mask. Palytoxin stays in water if under water but if you're working outside of water, which you will, you ryn the risk of breathing it in...
 
jccaclimber said:
First off, zoas or palys since they can be hard to tell apart, know that palytoxin is real. 99% of the time, probably more, it’s a non issue, but the time it is an issue is memorable. So, safety glasses, gloves if you have cuts on your hands, don’t touch your eyes. Soap and water on your hands for cleanup.

All that said, fragging zoas is pretty easy. You can remove a chunk of rock from under them and glue that to a plug if you want, but it isn’t required. Simply scraping them off of the rock with a blade works too. Some people like wax carving sets, others like scalpels. I’ve done both of those, used bare razor blades, and even dull screwdrivers in a pinch.
Once you have the polyp(s) cut free, put a dot of super glue on a plug, pad the bottom of the zoa dry momentarily, and plop it down in the glue. Single polyps can be hard to get a grip on, but I find surface tension keeps them stuck to my fingertip. Be sure to put the correct side down (hint, not the head). It may sound silly, but with smaller ones like hornets it can be hard to tell when they are all closed up.
After this stick it back in the tank and be on your way to the next one. When I started I liked doing them in small groups, but as I got better I started doing them individually. Once the individuals start growing a couple new heads at their base I consider them healed and ready for someone else’s tank. This only takes a few weeks in good conditions. Obviously you could send them on right away, but I like to play it safe.
Click to expand...

Oh yes I’ve definitely heard some stories about palytoxins. Whenever I put my hands in the tank I always go to wash them before doing anything else. Thank you very much for the input I’ll be giving it a go tmrw or Monday!


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NanoCrazed said:
I play it safe and always wear a N95 mask. Palytoxin stays in water if under water but if you're working outside of water, which you will, you ryn the risk of breathing it in...
Click to expand...

That’s good to know, I had no clue you could possibly inhale it as well. Thank you for the heads up!


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Zoas occasionally squirt out water like clams. It will go far enough that it might end up in your mouth or eyes. The cases of it ending up in the air that I've seen involve people literally boiling things, but there is definitely some slight mist that comes off of bandsaws as well.
I have one of these due to sanding lead paint in a house I used to own, so I wear it when fragging zoas: https://us.msasafety.com/p/000100000300001350?utm_source=search&utm_medium=suggested. I also clip my seatbelt when I move my car across the street and wear a helmet when test riding bicycle repairs in a parking lot.
Before I had that I went with either a face shield or a half face respirator and safety glasses. The big benefit I see is that respirators with silcone bases seal much better to my face than the lighter ones. They aren't nearly as comfortable after a couple hours, but few people frag for that long.
 
Xavier510 said:
That’s good to know, I had no clue you could possibly inhale it as well. Thank you for the heads up!


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Click to expand...

The friend of mine that got me into the hobby nearly died of palytoxin.

He got live rock from another reefer. Washed it, dried it, took a toothbrush to it to clean algae and stuff off it. Turns out there was a small zoa colony or something on the rock, because the toxin aerosolized.

He noticed something was off when his cat was breathing funny. Then he started having trouble breathing. He (and the cat) got to their respective hospitals pretty quick and made a full recovery, thankfully.

Moral of the story: you're fine, until you're not, with palytoxin. Not a gamble I want to take.
 
When I make frags of these things, I sometimes have to get close to see where I am cutting and to lift the polyps. sooooo... it's inevitable probability there'll be close calls without extra protection...
 
Finally gained enough courage Sunday night to start doing some fragging on the zoas and I will say once I got over the initial nervousness of it being my first time, it was very easy. I was able to make 7 frags total, mainly of my orange oxides since they looked the easiest to do but I also have a few others that I did. If anybody that offered any help in this thread would like a frag let me know and it’s yours.


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Does someone have a suggestion for gluing zoas down? I think I’m going to try holding the polys with tongs and set them in the glue, but I get glue all over my hands when I try to set the zoas down on the plug with glue using my hands. Is there a specific glove to use when using super glue that would help? It always peels off but I’d rather avoid the crusty fingers.
 
I put a dot of glue on the plug and dip it in water so it starts to cure then I put the zoa on. I also left them in a holding container for about 10 mins so the glue could get a chance to dry without any flow. So far all have stuck to the plug and are opened up.


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Xavier510 said:
I put a dot of glue on the plug and dip it in water so it starts to cure then I put the zoa on. I also left them in a holding container for about 10 mins so the glue could get a chance to dry without any flow. So far all have stuck to the plug and are opened up.


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Click to expand...
some zoas are finickier than others.. blue hornets take forever to open up and heal well enough for me to judge them ready to pass for example, yet some of the more challenging high ends just pop right open.
 
Xavier510 said:
I put a dot of glue on the plug and dip it in water so it starts to cure then I put the zoa on. I also left them in a holding container for about 10 mins so the glue could get a chance to dry without any flow. So far all have stuck to the plug and are opened up.


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Click to expand...
Ah good point, I think I just need to let the glue cure a few seconds longer before placing them. Thanks!
 
I use surface tension to hold the head end of the zoa to my finger, then plop the base into the fresh superglue. Then your fingertip is almost the length of the zoa away from the glue.
 
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