High Tide Aquatics

Help with what I think is cyano

Sduvall81

Sduvall81

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Hello everyone. I am in need of some help/advise. I am about at my wits end with this stuff and am considering taking down my tank if I cant resolve it. I have been battling with what I believe is cyano for the last four months. Its a red slime with bubbles in it that covers most of my substrate and is now creeping up my rocks. I have done weekly water changes where I manually remove it, I have a 5 stage rodi system and the tds meter reads 0 after the final stage. I've completely blacked out my tank for 72 hours, which helps but it is back within a day. I use a redsea test kit for nitrates and phosphates and they are always low. I purchased a Hanna phosphate meter just to double check and it is always below .02ppm. I have an auto feeder set for once a day on the lowest setting and the fish usually eat most of it. The tank has been set up for almost a year now.

Here is my equipment:
90 gal tank, eshopps r200 refugium, bubble magus skimmer, 2 mp40s, 2 kessil 360s, brs 2 stage phos/carbon reactor

Livestock:
5 blue reef chromis, 1 yellow tang, 2 clowns, 1 wrasse, 2 zoa colonys, 1 frogspawn and 1 acro

Water chemistry as of today:
temp: 76.5
PH: 8.07
salinity: 1.023
Nitrate: 0.25 ppm
Phosphate: 0.02 ppm
Mag: 1280 ppm
Cal: 375 ppm
Alk: 8.96 dkh

I think I covered everything. I would really appreciate any input you guys may have.
 

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1) Do you have enough flow? Cyanobacteria thrives in low flow areas.
  • It sounds like your nutrients are under control (maybe)
  • I dont think the kessils are shifting light spectrums, promoting cyano growth.
  • Your calcium is a little low but that is another topic.

Personally I would hit it with Boyd Chemiclean at this point. Pick it up at any local fish store and save money on shipping.

Read the instructions carefully. You need to aerate your tank because it will try and deplete the oxygen levels. Most also recommend turning off your skimmer and removing any carbon filters when treating with Chemi-clean.

@wpeterson any input?

More information here: http://kb.marinedepot.com/article.aspx?id=11162
 
I feel your pain, but I have not had that large of an area of issue with Cyano.

There is a product (Chemiclean) that you can put in your aquarium to help get rid of the cyano, I haven't used it in over 10yrs...as I will do a black out for a 3-7 days depending on how I see it dying off at night with a blue flashlight.

Also there are some cleanup crews that will eat cyano, I am not totally believe this 100%, but I added them to my tank for insurance....once you get it under control I recommend a black out asap so it does not have a chance to grow and spread...

Other Factors are:
Lighting (how long the lights are on and when was the last time to replaced your bulbs {if not LED})...I run a longer photo period then most of 12hrs
Water movement (low flow can increase your chances with a Cyano outbreak)

I hope this helps you get it under control...and don't give up yet...most of us have had to deal with it.

Here is some good info:
http://kb.marinedepot.com/article.aspx?id=11162
 
Thanks for the replys. I have good flow with the two mp40's. They are at opposite ends of the tank and go between reef crest mode and nutrient transport through the day. I've tried chemiclean before and it didnt seem to have any effect, however i did not oxygenate the water so that might have effected it. I'm currently trying a mix of coral snow and Zeobak from Korallen-zucht which was recommended to me by my lfs. I've only been dosing for a week but it doesnt seem to be doing anything.
 
What do you mean by good flow? Is it at the highest setting? Try removing as much cyano, then really push the flow as high as you can. And see what happens...

I know I'm excessive, but I have a Gyre 130 (max 2500 gph) and a Tunzo 6105 (max 3400 gph) in my 45g cube..
 
Something about your tank is fueling the growth of this cyanobacteria. Chemiclean kills cyanobacteria but it doesn't prevent it from coming back.

Did you notice the cyanobacteria dying after dosing the correct amount of Chemiclean? It should have died back.
The skimmer should be off and you shouldn't run carbon or other similar media so that the chemiclean can stay in your tank and do its job.

We should try to figure this out.

Do you broadcast feed any food? Throw frozen blocks of mysis and walk away? Oysterfeast?

My other advice is to really look into every component of your reef tank and see where you might have excess nutrients being added to your system. (examples: did you use someone's old sand, are your rocks still releasing nutrients, cat peeing in the aquarium, etc.)

Are your testkits giving you true results or are they faulty test kits?
 
ok, ill give that a shot. I keep them between 30 and 60 percent through the day. The corals seem to like that the best. Anything higher and they start to close up.
 
Thanks endturtle. Ha, I havnt noticed the cat peeing in there but will keep an eye out. All the sand Ive used has been new out of the bag. I cycled the tank when I first set it up and have not added any new rock since then. I did add some sand but I was already having a cyano problem at that point. I used to feed frozen mysis, but stopped when the outbreak first started months ago.

At this point I'm thinking about trying the Chemiclean again with an air stone and maybe replenishing my cleanup crew. I havn't added any new crabs or snails since after the cycle was done when i first set it up. Is this something that people do regularly? I'm sure snails/crabs die off and have seen replenishing packs on liveaquaria.com
 
Anything that dies should be removed. A dead turbo snail reaks of death and will surely up your nutrient load.

But tell us what happened after you tried chemiclean? Did it die? How quickly did it come back?

So if you have 110 gallons of total water you would need 11 scoops of the powder Chemiclean. I've heard it doesn't hurt to do a tiny bit more than the recommend dose.

I don't recommend using chemi clean in conjunction with the other products you mentioned since I'm not familiar with them.

but yeah keep chemi-clean as an option after you're done with the Coral Snow/Zeobak

There are a lot of people on here that have battled Cyanobacteria and won.

Aquarium oxygen levels MUST be increased using heavy aeration or large air stone.
Turn off UV sterilizer, ozonizer, and remove Chemi-pure, or carbon during treatment.
Maintain normal water flow using pumps and power heads.

For every ten (10) gallons of aquarium water, dissolve one level scoop (included) of ChemiClean into one cup of water removed from the aquarium.

Pour solution with dissolved ChemiClean back into aquarium, dispersing evenly. Successful treatment may take up to 48 hours. After the 48 hour treatment period, perform a 20% water change.
Click to expand...
 
I have used chemiclean once and had good luck. I had a mild but persistent cyano outbreak after over-feeding in our tank by our tank sitter while we were gone for two weeks. It's reef safe if used correctly, but you need to be very careful about the dosage and oxygenation of the water. I had good results and the cyano hasn't come back.

The key things for my dosing strategy were measuring water volume and chemiclean solution conservatively and leaving my skimmer running without a collection cup for 2-3 days. Chemiclean makes the skimmer go nuts and overflow, but I turned it down all the way and took the cup off to keep oxygenating the water.

So I would say - do some soul searching on your nutrient levels and nutrient export. Treat with chemiclean to remove the current outbreak. Get your nutrient export in line for the long run and maybe dose chemiclean again if needed.

If you're located in the South Bay, I'm happy to test your water with my Hanna ULR Phosphate meter or give you enough chemiclean for a first dose (the smallest size sold was enough for about 10x doses in my 90 gal).

Full details of my chemiclean experience in my tank journal starting here.
 
When I tried Chemiclean I used 10 scoops, estimating I had around 100 gallons of total water. I might have been a little under on my estimate, but did not want to overdose. It did kill some of it off, but not all of it and was back within a week of dosing. I turned off my skimmer and didn't have my reactor at that point. Maybe 11 scoops will be more effective
 
Thanks wpeterson. I live out in the eastbay but will keep that in mind. I relocated my mp40's closer to the substrate, hopefully that will help with the flow down there. That's a great idea with keeping the cup off the skimmer. I think im gonna hit the lfs and pick up some chemiclean and try it again.
 
Clean up crew on liveaquaria? Isn't shipping expensive? I would think it would be cheaper and better to get from your LFS. I get mine from Aquatic Collection in east bay hayward..

Hermits are great for algae and the small red tipped hermits... Turbo usually for everything else... I would add more snails and crabs to help, but I don't think that is the solution... Flow and nutrient source is probably key contributor to problem... I have a little red cyano pop up a day or two after I feed heavy...
 
Thanks humu. I'm gonna pay more attention to how much food my autofeeder is putting in the tank. I work crazy hours so an autofeeder is a necessity, otherwise I would just do it myself.
 
Well I just manually removed as much of it as I could and dosed chemiclean using 11 scoops. I took the cup off the skimmer and am letting it run. We shall see...thanks again for everyone's input.
 
Yeah, the dreaded Cyano battle. Fighting it again myself right now. You have my sympathy.

Your phosphates read low because the Cyano is consuming it. So ignore that test.

Siphoning Cyano out is key. I use a small airline hose for that.
Since it shows up so much on the sand bed, your sand bed may be saturated a bit.
Consider cleaning sand bed. Carefully.

If you JUST use chemiclean, it will disappear, but it will be back in a month or so with a vengeance.

My suggestion if it comes back (likely but not always)
1) Decrease feeding.
2) Be careful what you feed. Avoid phosphates.
3) Increase water changes
4) Temporarily put a big sock of GFO in the main tank. Yes ugly, but more effective.
5) Siphon Cyano like crazy.
After a week or two, you should notice a big decrease in growth.
THEN hit it with Chemiclean.
THEN add a lot more snails.

If you add a lot of snails to a tank full of Cyano, they tend to die.
But snails do tend to eat a bit of it, if there is only a tiny amount.
 
Thanks rygh. Ill give the smaller airline hose a shot. I've been using larger 1/2 tube, it does pretty well but I think the smaller tube is probably more effective.
 
I would address the cause 1st. If not, it will come back again.

From your post, I see that you have an automated feeder feeding once a day. I suggest you cut the amount in half and spread out the feelings into smaller portions of possible. This will help reduce the amount of waste.

My cyano issues went away when I reduced the amount I feed the fish and reduced the times I do broadcast feeding for corals.

Right now I don't use a filter sock or floss/sponge normally. However, after I feed the fish or broadcast feed the coral, I put in a section of filter floss under the drain of the overflow, catching any bigger chunks of food left over. I leave it for 30 mins then pull it.

Haven't had an issue with cyano since.

Though I am fighting hair algae at the moment and it's back n forth with it.


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