Cali Kid Corals

inappropriate sized fish

A_Lee

A_Lee

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We've all been here before
What fish have you purchased that you know will get too large for your tank? Now for the onslaught of questions.
Did the fish actually outgrow the tank, or get to the size where it needed to be removed? What size was/is the tank? How long did it take? How often, and how much did you feed?
How did you catch the fish out?
 
Honey Comb Grouper
Didn't outgrow tank as I resold him via the wholesaler I worked at (special case)
Didn't get to a size too large for tank but he grew several inches very fast prompting me to get rid of him before he got to large to ship
6 months IIRC
Feed him fish from work every 3 - 4 days - couple damsels
Hook and line (barbless egg hook)

Haven't bought anything too large for my tank since accept for the current foxface in my tank that is being quarantined for work.
 
Indo Pacific Sargent Major -Didn't purchase this fish, I caught him from a tidepool in Hawaii for a classroom tank I was setting up. I couldn't release him after the year was up because they are not native to Hawaii. (At least I believe this to be true) I know someone will correct me if I'm wrong. (Then I'll feel really stupid that I didn't release him)
Caught him when he was the size of a dime, now 4 inches and still growing. Should max out at 5-6 inches.
Currently imprisoned in a 10 gallon QT tank because he is too agressive for my other fish. But will move to a 30 gal. once Ich treatments are over in that tank. (Looking for a new home with other larger agressive fish. We really love him- he is smart and funny.)
Going on 2 years.
Will eat anything and in any amount, but I feed 1-2 times a day- If he could break through the glass to get to the fish food bottle, he would. Taps on the thermometer or heater to get your attention to be fed. Especially if you leave the room. ;D
 
Echoing Gresh ... I've seen the adults around pilings at the Kona wharf plus while diving. Besides, if it was caught as a juvenile from a tidepool, then that pretty much assures that there are breeding populations locally.
 
www.fishbase.org

Abudefduf notatus
Yellowtail sergeant

http://fishbase.org/Summary/speciesSummary.php?ID=5686&genusname=Abudefduf&speciesname=notatus

pic_Fis-25761.jpg
 
I've actually been wondering how you decide when a fish gets too large for the tank. I've got a blue tang in my 180 that on some days looks cramped. It's probably close to 9" now, and I keep wondering if at some point I'll need to rehome it. I got it at around 2" in Jan/Feb 2005 - originally had it in a 70g where it got to about 5", then transferred it to the 180 in Jan '07. Seemed like it went through a growth spurt when we upgraded. I only feed once a day.
 
I believe a fish will grow faster if given more ample room (larger tank) to do so. A 2"-3" blue tang placed in a 50g would not grow nearly as fast a similar sized blue tang housed in a 150g.
I don't feed every day, so growth is somewhat limited w/ the fish I've got.
 
I came home from a business trip a few years ago to find that my wife had "suprised" me with a gift. A cow fish for my 75 gallon reef. :-X Of course it was way to slow for it to get the food it needed with the tang and wrasses I had in the tank AND it was already starting to nip at my corals AND 75 gallons is way to small for it. It was easy enough to catch with a fish trap and I gave it to a budy with a well established 250g. From what I understand he's grown from the 1" size that I got him at and is now over 4" in just a few years.
 
Lyn, from what I remember of my book on Hawaiian fishes I picked up, the sergeant major isn't a native species originally, however it migrated there, and took up residence and it ain't leaving any time soon, so tossing it back in thee water would have been ok I'd think.
 
[quote author=A_Lee link=topic=6457.msg83001#msg83001 date=1235153747]
I believe a fish will grow faster if given more ample room (larger tank) to do so. A 2"-3" blue tang placed in a 50g would not grow nearly as fast a similar sized blue tang housed in a 150g.
I don't feed every day, so growth is somewhat limited w/ the fish I've got.
[/quote]

Common myth but just that, sorry.
 
[quote author=sfsuphysics link=topic=6457.msg83009#msg83009 date=1235155303]
Lyn, from what I remember of my book on Hawaiian fishes I picked up, the sergeant major isn't a native species originally, however it migrated there, and took up residence and it ain't leaving any time soon, so tossing it back in thee water would have been ok I'd think.
[/quote]
Why speculate when I gave a link to a very in depth Fish site? Why just a half second of looking yields the native range map :p

pic_Fis-25761.jpg
 
[quote author=GreshamH link=topic=6457.msg83014#msg83014 date=1235155996]
[quote author=sfsuphysics link=topic=6457.msg83009#msg83009 date=1235155303]
Lyn, from what I remember of my book on Hawaiian fishes I picked up, the sergeant major isn't a native species originally, however it migrated there, and took up residence and it ain't leaving any time soon, so tossing it back in thee water would have been ok I'd think.
[/quote]
Why speculate when I gave a link to a very in depth Fish site? Why just a half second of looking yields the native range map :p
[/quote]
Could be because the speculation was from the picture that you actually posted originally, I assume you were trying to make a point, however I guess your weren't and you just felt like posting a random picture with a bunch of red dots that included Hawaii in it.

What you posted originally in case you so easily forgot.
pic_Fis-25761.jpg
 
That is that map where they are found Mike....follow the link :D
 
"Nemo" doesn't look like A. notatus. He doesn't have a yellow tail. He is yellow on top of his body and has bluish tinged pelvic and anal fins. I tried to get a good picture, but after 50 tries, this is all I got. I found an old picture of him too. In the first picture, you can see that he is missing his pectoral fin on his right side.

IMGP4252.jpg
IMGP4238-1.jpg
IMGP4260.jpg


IMGP3898-1.jpg


At the time (2 years ago), I did a search for all the native Hawaiian damsels, and his picture did not show up, so I assumed he was a bilge baby brought in as planktonic larvae from somewhere in the Indopacific. You know, all that shipping between Hawaii and the coasts and islands of different nations. I couldn't, in good conscience, release him since I thought he was non-native to the islands; and I couldn't, in good conscience, kill him. So he got shipped to California with my other fish.

I narrowed his species down to 3 possibilities:

1. Abudefduf saxatilis-Sergeant major from Atlantic, highly unlikely.
http://fishbase.org/Photos/ThumbnailsSummary.php?ID=1119
2. Abudefduf vaigiensis- My best guess, but according to fish data base, it was replaced by A. abdominalis in the Hawaiian islands, so still not native.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-Pacific_sergeant
3. Abudefduf troschelii- Another possibility since Hawaii gets alot of shipping from California, but their bars are not as thick as A. vaigiensis, and Nemo's is.
http://fishbase.org/Summary/speciesSummary.php?ID=8245&genusname=Abudefduf&speciesname=troschelii

Then today, I found this:

Abudefduf abdominalis- "The Hawaiian Sergeant probably descended from the Indo-Pacific Sergeant, A. vaigiensis, (above) a species widespread in the Indo-Pacific outside Hawai`i. Until about 1990 the Indo-Pacific Sergeant was unknown in the Islands; it has somehow been introduced (perhaps drifting in with abandoned fishing gear) and now almost always occurs in small numbers wherever the Hawaiian species is present. The two species do not appear to be interbreeding. The Indo-Pacific Sergeant sports bright yellow on its back and has longer, broader, darker bars than the Hawaiian Sergeant."

So, I guess there are now breeding populations of A. vaigiensis in the Hawaiian Islands. None of the information I looked at 2 years ago stated this. Still, I don't know if I would have or should have released him. Hawaii is very protective of their native species and very wary of introduced species. Of course this info is 2 years too late, but I'm curious- What would you have done?
 
Fish are just like coral and can not truly be ID'd by color alone as color can change from location to location and even very amongst local morphs. You count fins, use fin shape, etc :)

Good searching though, I spent all of 1 minute on it :) Had I hit my books rather then doing a google I would have had much better success (Damsels of the World)
 
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