Lanthanum dosing, check my math…

[JVU]

Is there a SeaKlear version for reef aquaria or are you guys using the stuff made for pools? Any concerns with that? I have a bunch of lanthanum for pools already (other brands) but wouldn’t be comfortable putting it in my tank since they don’t disclose everything in the bottle.

 

[Turkeysammich]

Is there a SeaKlear version for reef aquaria or are you guys using the stuff made for pools? Any concerns with that? I have a bunch of lanthanum for pools already (other brands) but wouldn’t be comfortable putting it in my tank since they don’t disclose everything in the bottle.

I don’t think there’s one for aquariums. I use that one because that’s what Richard Ross uses. Figured he’s smarter than I am so I shall follow him. There are different labels of the Seaklear. I just bought the one that he shows in his videos.
In life, you don’t have to be smart but surround yourself with smarter people then yourself.

 

[L/B Block]

Except the SeaKlear is a concentrated version and is to be diluted. The TM version can be diluted as well if suppose but not necessary. That's my understanding of it anyway.

I dilute the TM 40:1 —for the seaklear it’s 100:1 I believe.. so in that sense

 

[JVU]

I dilute the TM 40:1 —for the seaklear it’s 100:1 I believe.. so in that sense

SeaKlear is roughly 30x more concentrated than TM E-P Rapid by my calculations. Not 2.5x.

For reference:
SK: 1 oz in 5000g reduces 0.5 ppm
TM: 1 ml in 100 liters reduces 0.1 ppm

 

[JVU]

Is there a SeaKlear version for reef aquaria or are you guys using the stuff made for pools? Any concerns with that? I have a bunch of lanthanum for pools already (other brands) but wouldn’t be comfortable putting it in my tank since they don’t disclose everything in the bottle.

I don’t think there’s one for aquariums. I use that one because that’s what Richard Ross uses. Figured he’s smarter than I am so I shall follow him. There are different labels of the Seaklear. I just bought the one that he shows in his videos.
In life, you don’t have to be smart but surround yourself with smarter people then yourself.

So besides the deferring to what other with expertise have used, which is fine, does anyone know about this? I noticed when googling this that the use of SeaKIear looks mostly just like historical coincidence because it’s a brand that was available for pools many years ago when people were trying this, before lanthanum was available for the hobby. We’ve improved a lot of things in the past couple decades and made reef-safe versions of things.

 

[L/B Block]

Think I miscalculated from Rich’s post as
I didn’t read it too closely. I think if I switch -I’ll pay a bit more attention. But it def seems to pack a punch alright.

I concur that I’d be a bit queasy using it not knowing what exactly is in it -but if others are using it without issue long term I am a bit piqued..

 

[Alexander1312]

I am currently more concerned about lanthanum phosphate, I.e., the end product of using lanthanum chloride, to be extremely sticky clogging pumps over time etc.

I was not aware of this, but some rather knowledgeable folks in other groups I am part in, advice against using this in skimmers, and that what could come out of skimmer might still contain this.

Are we are aware of this and is our argument that this is a non issue because we are using a super high diluted version of lanthanum chloride so clogging up pumps is not an issue?

I never knew why it could become an issue with e.g. tangs but it is now much clearer to me. I assume we believe it is all skimmed out immediately?

I would like to use it only temporarily against flatworms, when I come back only, but dosing it into a proper filter floss type of setup seems safer.

 

[Thales]

I am currently more concerned about lanthanum phosphate, I.e., the end product of using lanthanum chloride, to be extremely sticky clogging pumps over time etc.

I was not aware of this, but some rather knowledgeable folks in other groups I am part in, advice against using this in skimmers, and that what could come out of skimmer might still contain this.

Are we are aware of this and is our argument that this is a non issue because we are using a super high diluted version of lanthanum chloride so clogging up pumps is not an issue?

I never knew why it could become an issue with e.g. tangs but it is now much clearer to me. I assume we believe it is all skimmed out immediately?

I would like to use it only temporarily against flatworms, when I come back only, but dosing it into a proper filter floss type of setup seems safer.

Yes, as discussed in the other thread, this this being an issue would be due to a misapplication of Lanth in a skimmer (it really can be a problem with lanth in any application). It is not a hammer to bang down phosphate quickly - if you do that with any method you risk problems with 'plating' onto glass or acrylic or pump parts or fish gills. This has always been a known risk associated with lanth dosing in reef tanks.
I have been dosing into my skimmer for six years with no problems. I know several others with similar stories.

 

[derek_SR]

I am currently more concerned about lanthanum phosphate, I.e., the end product of using lanthanum chloride, to be extremely sticky clogging pumps over time etc.

I was not aware of this, but some rather knowledgeable folks in other groups I am part in, advice against using this in skimmers, and that what could come out of skimmer might still contain this.

Are we are aware of this and is our argument that this is a non issue because we are using a super high diluted version of lanthanum chloride so clogging up pumps is not an issue?

I never knew why it could become an issue with e.g. tangs but it is now much clearer to me. I assume we believe it is all skimmed out immediately?

I would like to use it only temporarily against flatworms, when I come back only, but dosing it into a proper filter floss type of setup seems safer.

In addition to what @Thales said, I would also add that when you fuck it up lanthanum WILL show up on your ICP test (at least Triton tests lanthanum, not sure about FM). I had a skimmer accident and was dosing lanthanum into a skimmer that wasn't running for a while and lanth immediately popped on the next ICP. So you can hold the process accountable in this way as well. I think when done slowly and correctly it absolutely does not escape the skimmer and can be done safely for long periods of time.

So besides the deferring to what other with expertise have used, which is fine, does anyone know about this? I noticed when googling this that the use of SeaKIear looks mostly just like historical coincidence because it’s a brand that was available for pools many years ago when people were trying this, before lanthanum was available for the hobby. We’ve improved a lot of things in the past couple decades and made reef-safe versions of things.

Personally it does seem silly to me, with the huge amounts of money we spend elsewhere, to save a couple of bucks with a product that is of dubious purity and quality. The reef-specific lanthanum products from trustworthy reef brands are still also VERY CHEAP. I am still on my original bottle and it's been over a year. I don't even remember what it cost me, less than a single frag probably. No sense trying to penny pinch here, IMO, even if the risk is very low. I just trust a product made for pools and hot tubs less than one made specifically for reef tanks, even if there's a 99.9% chance it's safe. The savings (in this instance) is simply a non issue.

 

[ReyDeFarts]

Personally it does seem silly to me, with the huge amounts of money we spend elsewhere, to save a couple of bucks with a product that is of dubious purity and quality. The reef-specific lanthanum products from trustworthy reef brands are still also VERY CHEAP. I am still on my original bottle and it's been over a year. I don't even remember what it cost me, less than a single frag probably. No sense trying to penny pinch here, IMO, even if the risk is very low. I just trust a product made for pools and hot tubs less than one made specifically for reef tanks, even if there's a 99.9% chance it's safe. The savings (in this instance) is simply a non issue.

Very good point! The bottles I got of the TM Elimi-Phos will likely last me a year or longer if I used them in a diluted form, dosed into the skimmer as has been mentioned.

Also, many companies are not above simply rebranding the exact same product with consumers not knowing any different and paying more. So there is that. But at the end of the day, we are indeed literally talking about a difference of pennies with this product it seems.

 

[derek_SR]

Very good point! The bottles I got of the TM Elimi-Phos will likely last me a year or longer if I used them in a diluted form, dosed into the skimmer as has been mentioned.

Also, many companies are not above simply rebranding the exact same product with consumers not knowing any different and paying more. So there is that. But at the end of the day, we are indeed literally talking about a difference of pennies with this product it seems.

You ain't wrong, although some companies seem fairly reputable. I like to support two little fishies (this is where I got my bottle of lanthanum) because I like Julian Sprung, he's a reefer and scientist, and I hope he signs my book someday. I already got my @CharlesJohns58 signature...