Cali Kid Corals

Tang in a 4'x2' 50 gallon?

IOnceWasLegend

IOnceWasLegend

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I'm aware I'm opening a can of worms, but since I trust the people here more than other forums:

I'm in the final stages of putting together/planning out the frag tank, and I've been thinking about a tang to help with algae control.

My understanding is that a 50 gallon 4'x2' tank would be borderline (if not too small) for a yellow tang due to 4' being the minimum length. Would something like a kole or tomini tang be a better idea for a tank that size, or would they still get too big for it?
 
I don't want to sound all tang police like here, but I would most definitely say no, just don't do it for any type of tang, there really isn't a lot of swimming room in a tank that small, and 4'x2' tank? so it's a frag tank that's only 10" tall?
 
sfsuphysics said:
I don't want to sound all tang police like here, but I would most definitely say no, just don't do it for any type of tang, there really isn't a lot of swimming room in a tank that small, and 4'x2' tank? so it's a frag tank that's only 10" tall?
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Correct re: 10" tall. I know very little about larger fish/tangs (which is why I'm asking here), aside from 4' being minimum length and ~55 gallons being minimum size.

And as far as being the tang police: I'm totally fine with that, since I want to make sure I'm doing right by anything I put in my tank. I'd rather make a bigger headache for myself than subject an animal to inhumane conditions.
 
There are different schools of thought, I've heard people argue fish won't grow larger than the tank allows, and I've seen the opposite of this happen. I mean obviously they would grow larger than the physical tank but they'll grow as much as food allows them to grow. If you're looking to an algae control method for a frag tank though, I would look into snails over fish for that unless you had a really large frag flat.
 
With a frag tank it would be easier to get a baby yellow tang and remove it as it gets bigger to trade in at a LFS. But why bother? I think you can accomplish what your looking for with other CUC. If you keep nutrients low algae won’t be much of an issue anyways for the frag tank since you can keep it bare bottom and clean
 
sfsuphysics said:
There are different schools of thought, I've heard people argue fish won't grow larger than the tank allows, and I've seen the opposite of this happen. I mean obviously they would grow larger than the physical tank but they'll grow as much as food allows them to grow. If you're looking to an algae control method for a frag tank though, I would look into snails over fish for that unless you had a really large frag flat.
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Yeah; I've never really bought into the 'fish will grow only to fit the tank' line. The fish won't physically outgrow the tank, but that doesn't mean it can't grow large enough to cause problems in the existing tank.

max_nano said:
With a frag tank it would be easier to get a baby yellow tang and remove it as it gets bigger to trade in at a LFS. But why bother? I think you can accomplish what your looking for with other CUC. If you keep nutrients low algae won’t be much of an issue anyways for the frag tank since you can keep it bare bottom and clean
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Well, part of it is I was leaning towards a fish that I can't really keep in my display tank. Plus I'd like to upgrade to a larger tank (70-100 gallons) in the next year or two, and a tang would likely be on my list after that upgrade. I guess it'd depend on how quickly the tang grows, since if they reach full size in only a year or so I'd likely not want to go that route since I doubt I'd be ready for the upgrade at that point.
 
IOnceWasLegend said:
Plus I'd like to upgrade to a larger tank (70-100 gallons) in the next year or two, and a tang would likely be on my list after that upgrade. I guess it'd depend on how quickly the tang grows, since if they reach full size in only a year or so I'd likely not want to go that route since I doubt I'd be ready for the upgrade at that point.
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I would wait until you have that tank and then get the tang. I thought I was going to have a bigger tank so I got a tiny little yellow tang. Once I knew I wasn’t upgrading, it was difficult to remove the tang and I felt I put it through some stress that wasn’t necessary. Hindsight 20/20 I would not have done it until I had a tank ready for it, but just my opinion based on my experience with it.

Luckily I traded my yellow boy Frank away and he’s now swimming in a 300g
 
Not saying it’s a good size for them, for kole or tomini over yellow for algae eating all day.
I would use 1-2 small tuxedo urchins (if needed) and I’ll give you baby trochus. I only use the baby trochus and pods in my frag tanks.
 
Some of the smaller tangs would survive. They are tough. But they would not thrive.
Also, you are going to very quickly hit your bio-load limit as well. Tangs and other big algae eaters pollute.
So you would end up with just 1 or 2 fish.

Much better to go with several smaller fish.
 
Pretty much agree with everything here. The Kole/Tomini Tang do a bit better with less room than a Yellow Tang. And as @Coral reefer stated are better at eating algae. IME, in my 300g, they don’t grow THAT fast, but they do tend to grow faster when they are real small.
 
I was going to say that a kole/tomini would be possible, but not a good idea.
Rather than saying "Fish do not outgrow their tanks" I like to say "Fish can stunted by their tanks and conditions".
My tangs are for the most part fat and happy in the 170 (5' tank) that I have them in, but I can tell they don't behave the way they did when they were in a larger tank, and they are not particularly big tangs.
 
Coral reefer said:
Not saying it’s a good size for them, for kole or tomini over yellow for algae eating all day.
I would use 1-2 small tuxedo urchins (if needed) and I’ll give you baby trochus. I only use the baby trochus and pods in my frag tanks.
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I'll take you up on that, then, and thank you!

Once the tank stabilizes that'll be a good opportunity for me to pick up the acans (and, if you're still okay with it, get your help cutting the Ultron favia to give a frag back to Bob and start a dbtc).
 
I think completely opposite than everyone else. 4‘x2’ is plenty of room for a Kole tang and even a small yellow tang for a year or two.

Tangs are significantly better than any other clean up crew I’ve ever had, and worth any potential ”risk” to the animal. Plus in a Frag tank you don’t want to worry about your nutrients bottoming out, and tangs help with that. Plus plus, Frag tanks are easy to quickly remove frag racks and net a fish once it’s getting too big.
 
Rostato said:
I think completely opposite than everyone else. 4‘x2’ is plenty of room for a Kole tang and even a small yellow tang for a year or two.

Tangs are significantly better than any other clean up crew I’ve ever had, and worth any potential ”risk” to the animal. Plus in a Frag tank you don’t want to worry about your nutrients bottoming out, and tangs help with that. Plus plus, Frag tanks are easy to quickly remove frag racks and net a fish once it’s getting too big.
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I agree, as long as you have a plan to re-home the tang when it gets too big it should not be a problem. I have a 1.5" Yellow tang I bought from AC in my IM 50g Lagoon 30"x24"x16" and it's doing great.
 
jccaclimber said:
My concern is that while many people plan to rehome fish as they grow, very few actually do, or wait until it has clearly been too long.
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I honestly have not seen a tang in a tank that was too small in a long time. Maybe those people just hide them, but I personally have not seen this to be true. A frag tank is very different. Its significantly easier to re-home from a frag tank vs a display.
 
My regal is a fine example of this. It was in a standard 4’ 75. Not plump, but not skinny. I figured all was well until the owner claimed he got it as the same time as his 9” clam, roughly 10 years earlier. The regal should be twice that size, but is some combination of underfed, cramped, etc that has stunted it.

It isn’t as if we’re keeping a working dog in a one room apartment, but it’s a bit harder to recommend when you know how they behave in larger spaces.

An important distinction that I want to make here is that I’m not saying it’s impossible or unusually cruel, we all keep the ocean in a comparatively little box for our pleasure. I’m just trying to help people understand what the longer term issues may be, and issues I have seen come up in the past.
 
Yeah I'm torn on the matter, on one hand I totally get trading away living creatures because yeah they're fish/corals/inverts not dogs or other animals that really become bonded to a person, and for the sake of not sounding completely stupid I'll remove corals and other inverts from that list because at least fish have eyes and recognize you :). But I've taken fish from others, I've given fish away, but what I've taken was because of someone breaking down and what I've given away was due to aggression. But on the other hand it just seems a bit thoughtless to go into the purchasing of a fish with the intention of giving it away from the very beginning, the idea "I only want to use it while it's small and useful" just is something I don't personally like.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm not saying others are bad who do this, it's just a personal feeling I have on it and like most things in life you're happier when people think the way you do :)
 
sfsuphysics said:
Yeah I'm torn on the matter, on one hand I totally get trading away living creatures because yeah they're fish/corals/inverts not dogs or other animals that really become bonded to a person, and for the sake of not sounding completely stupid I'll remove corals and other inverts from that list because at least fish have eyes and recognize you :). But I've taken fish from others, I've given fish away, but what I've taken was because of someone breaking down and what I've given away was due to aggression. But on the other hand it just seems a bit thoughtless to go into the purchasing of a fish with the intention of giving it away from the very beginning, the idea "I only want to use it while it's small and useful" just is something I don't personally like.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm not saying others are bad who do this, it's just a personal feeling I have on it and like most things in life you're happier when people think the way you do :)
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And this was part of why I'd asked. Sure, they're fish, but I'm of the 'when you get a pet, you agree to care for it it's *whole* life" persuasion, due in large part to the professions of people close to me giving me a very good look at just how poorly a lot of animals are treated.

That's not to say people who do otherwise are wrong (this is an emotional, rather than logical, viewpoint; since my neuroanatomy courses cast a pretty grim look on what fish actually understand/can process), but I asked because I wasn't sure if the tank would be large enough, and - if it wasn't - I wanted to make sure I'd have time to get an upgrade prior to making a commitment. Since it looks like that's not the case, I'll end up foregoing the tang for now and waiting until I get my eventual upgrade tank.
 
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