got ethical husbandry?

My first Fish copper Qt treatment

MichaelB

Facilities/Events
BOD
To start things off, I thought I would start a thread hear specifically related to this topic and my progress. The fact being that I've never did this before. Knowing that at somepoint all the advice and wisdom shared here would likely be off benefit to others now or in the future.

My tank journal is linked below if anyone wants to catch up on the discussion and general progression of the tank.



I've have done tons of research in the past on this subject and some more recent which I will continue to do during the process.

I've lost 3 entire tanks of fish in the past 3.5 years in to the hobby. If I remember correctly it was some time roughly a year ago.


1.) The first likey do to a outbreak of velvet introduction of a blue tang to a existing tank . All the fish were dead within 24-30 hours from first seeing the signs. I ordered next day medication with prime. Sadly I didn't get them in time to even prepare to treat the fish.

* the lesson there have some meds on hand even if things are perfect as time may not be on your side.

2.) The second event occurred a week after that. In a separate tank that was on the opposite side of the garage as the previous tank. I had fish in that for well over two weeks. I got some new rock dry rock structures and just added them in with
The fish. Within 3 days of adding them I came home from work and basically had what I suspect was a massive ammonia spike and I lost the entire tank.

* lesson learned here is always take the time to cure new rocks even if they are dry and appear clean/ unused. Especially don't add them to a existing tank without even a minimum curing time.

3.) The third time was like 4 months later. I received 3-4 fish from a tank break down. I added them to a tank that only had one pajama cardinal in it. 5 days after adding them I noticed spots. This time I was proactive. I read videos on natural products that didn't include copper. So I had them on hand already and treated two products according to the labels. It looked as though the fish improved over 2.5 weeks. Skip to week three I didn't see but maybe 1 spot here and there. I relaxed yet contined to treat with the natural products per there label. It was like almost over night the ick returned but three times worse and the medication was no longer effective. They died over the next 2 daya after looking better and more active.

*The lesson there was don't believe the marketing claims of so called natural remedies from online searches. Most in the club here would have told me not to bother had I asked. When the fish appeared to get better was only partner icks life cycle. They drop off the fish and than rapidly increase in numbers. Meaning that those magic potions did absolutely nothing.

If you want a thorough incite in to my current situation it's outline on my tank journal.

The short version is my current 210gallon tank has ich. I'm planning to treat all of the fish with copper power and allow the tank to go fallow.

In the pst below will show the current qt set
And current items.
 
Current Fish in this tank.

Porcupine Puffer, 2 lighting marron clowns, Green (pastel)corsis wrasse, yellow corsis,Melanurus Wrasse, 2 Banggai Cardinal, scopas tang, clown tang,Flame dwarf angel, Coral beauty dwarf angel, Yellow tang, Scopas Tang, foxface and a Starry blenny.

I ordered a 127 gallon koi pond which arrived today.

20260213_202228.jpg
20260213_202239.jpg
20260213_202321.jpg


1.) I also grabbed several 4 inch elbows from home depot to give the fish hiding spots.

2.) I have a box of 4 xxl sponge filters.

3.) I plan to run a bubble magus curve 5 skimmer with out the cap for added aeration.

4.) I have a 15 gallon ato resivor that I plan to run.

5.) I have a Hanna copper checker with 25 test packets. I ordered another 25 pack of reagent.

6.) I had one bottle of copper power I've also ordered 2 more for backup.

7.) I have a stick on ammonia alert badge. I addtion, I finally ordered a Hanna ammonia checker for emergencies and to know without playing the guess the color game that I've previously done.

8.) I ordered another pump/hose to use for water changes so I don't have to share between tanks and risk infecting my other tanks.

I mixed 55 gallons of saltwater and have it heating in the barrel. Beyond that I have a 32 gallon of rodi water and my other 55gallon barrel full of rodi. I'll likey only fill the pond to the halfway mark or just above it.

I will likely fill the tank tomorrow and get treatment started over the weekend.
 

Attachments

  • 20260213_202405.jpg
    20260213_202405.jpg
    46.7 KB · Views: 3
  • 20260213_202341.jpg
    20260213_202341.jpg
    69.6 KB · Views: 3
I could be wrong, I think puffer no like copper
I saw one article said they can tolerate copper power but not the other types. In addtion I saw a utuber treating one.

Of course I won't go off a single non expert online source/ video Without more research.

Maybe I need to see if Kenny has time to chat . Yet I will plan to specifically research each individual fish. As of now the puffer has it the worst. Still eating but it's concerning.
 
Whenever someone offers me a "free fish" I know it comes with free diseases too. Gotta QT all fish unless they're coming directly from Kenny or Biota. I go a step further and have a fishless tank in the back for new corals.

Also it would be a lot easier doing this in like a 40 breeder or two, you don't need a display sized tank for a temporary QT.
 
Agreed with @Darkxerox. I have medicated quarantined all my fish other than the ones which came from Kenny or Biota. So far no disease outbreaks since I started my tank 2.5 years ago. I use a cheap 10 gallon tank from Petco with a large Fluval hang-on back filter and a heater. I have blacked out three sides of the tank and put in PVC elbows.

@MichaelB Make sure you cycle the quarantine tank and/or put in some live filter media or something loaded with bacteria. I keep sponge filter in a small container of saltwater and use that whenever I restart my QT tank. I also pour in some MicrobeLife Special Blend. The filter media + bottled bacteria make a big difference. I recently set up a quarantine tank for some of my CUC (didn’t want them to die as I go through a cycle of Interceptor) and didn’t use either of those and I got a bacteria bloom within 24 hours. Once I did a water change, put on the hang-on back filter, and poured in some bottled bacteria the water cleared up significantly.

When I do water changes on my QT I dose the new saltwater up to 2.5ppm copper. I keep a bucket of saltwater with 2.5ppm copper sitting around when I go through QT. The copper level in the bucket stays stable and I have never seen the copper level in the QT tank decline below therapeutic levels either (usually there is no material change).

Second, if I were you I would fill up the water level to near the top (ie, not just halfway as you are planning). The reason why is there is not as much surface area and concentration of bacteria in the QT since it does not have the porous rock, sand, size, and maturity of a well-functioning reef tank. With higher water volume it will give you more leeway if you are planning to put that many fish into the QT. When I first started running QT tanks I put in too many fish which meant I had to do more frequent and larger water changes. Now I try to run QT on only one large or three small fish in a 10 gallon. One way I will upgrade to a 15 or 20 gallon for even more leeway.

Lastly, you should consider moving a powerhead from your display tank to the QT system. The tangs will appreciate the flow and the powerhead will help with oxygen exchange via water surface movement.
 
Last edited:
Whenever someone offers me a "free fish" I know it comes with free diseases too. Gotta QT all fish unless they're coming directly from Kenny or Biota. I go a step further and have a fishless tank in the back for new corals.

Also it would be a lot easier doing this in like a 40 breeder or two, you don't need a display sized tank for a temporary QT.
Yeah it probably would. I gave away the 50gallon tank I had the week before, and a 40 breeder i had a few months before that. In a effort to clean out the extra larger tanks.

I also didn't have any thing to set those tanks on like a stand or something. I only have folding tables that I wouldn't trust with the weight.

I saw this pond thing and figured It's wide and long so fish would be able to swim openly like they are use to in the two and not be more stressed.

I also worried about the clown tang in a smaller tank with other fish he's already turning into a jerk.

I'm not totally disregarding buying two 40s but each would cost the same as this thing I have. I would have to likey set them both on the ground ? Would that be a problem?

I wouldn't wanna keep the two tanks long term either considering the space they would take up. This thing could be broken down and put back in the box another selling point in my mind in any case.

Yet I haven't added water to this pond thing yet. It's from Amazon so I could probably return it.


Overall biggest things I considered are it didn't need a stand and the fish could swim around.
 
Agreed with @Darkxerox. I have medicated quarantined all my fish other than the ones which came from Kenny or Biota. So far no disease outbreaks since I started my tank 2.5 years ago. I use a cheap 10 gallon tank from Petco with a large Fluval hang-on back filter and a heater. I have blacked out three sides of the tank and put in PVC elbows.

@MichaelB Make sure you cycle the quarantine tank and/or put in some live filter media or something loaded with bacteria. I keep sponge filter in a small container of saltwater and use that whenever I restart my QT tank. I also pour in some MicrobeLife Special Blend. The filter media + bottled bacteria make a big difference. I recently set up a quarantine tank for some of my CUC (didn’t want them to die as I go through a cycle of Interceptor) and didn’t use either of those and I got a bacteria bloom within 24 hours. Once I did a water change, put on the hang-on back filter, and poured in some bottled bacteria the water cleared up significantly.

When I do water changes on my QT I dose the new saltwater up to 2.5ppm copper. I keep a bucket of saltwater with 2.5ppm copper sitting around when I go through QT. The copper level in the bucket stays stable and I have never seen the copper level in the QT tank decline below therapeutic levels either (usually there is no material change).

Second, if I were you I would fill up the water level to near the top (ie, not just halfway as you are planning). The reason why is there is not as much surface area and concentration of bacteria in the QT since it does not have the porous rock, sand, size, and maturity of a well-functioning reef tank. With higher water volume it will give you more leeway if you are planning to put that many fish into the QT. When I first started running QT tanks I put in too many fish which meant I had to do more frequent and larger water changes. Now I try to run QT on only one large or three small fish in a 10 gallon. One way I will upgrade to a 15 or 20 gallon for even more leeway.

Lastly, you should consider moving a powerhead from your display tank to the QT system. The tangs will appreciate the flow and the powerhead will help with oxygen exchange via water surface movement.
I've been wanting to consider bio media! Yet I was scared off by some sources say they can absorb copper making things harder tk keep stable. At the same time they would help a ton with fighting off ammonia. How do you balance, consider or plan for that I honestly have no idea???

The sponges I have have biosphere in side of them. I suppose I could toss one in the sump of my sps tank for a quick soak.

I could also add some sumps rocks, I also have ( bio bricks yet the bricks are too costly to sacrifice) Yet ai heard they can absorb copper and cause the numbers to fluctuate. and once theynstr used they can never be used in a reef tank again.

Would maybe just adding one or 2 small sump rocks be ok or recommended

- not to the point of it throwing off copper levels in qt. Not sure if small ones would be enough to effect things?


I also have been thinking about flow but am I right in assuming equipment used in qt is basically useless in terms of using it without risk in a reef tank again?

I have a skimmer I've already accepted as a sacrifice to qt. I have a much better heater with it's own controller that I would prefer to use but meh I don't wanna scarfice it, so was planning to use a crappy glass one.

I have a generic wave make probably not great especially compared to mu mp40s.

I have 4 total mp40s for the 210. One of them I haven't installed on the tank yet. Same doubts as before I know only the wet side would be in the tank yet it feels shameful or hard to sacrifice a wetside to qt. Something I would have to replace before using it in my display in the future.

So I've been thinking in terms of what can I use for qt that won't bother me not being able to use in for my reefs again. Maybe I could find a few more crapy korrlia wave makes for under the water currents. The one crappy wave maker I have does have a magnet so could be closer to the surface. I do have a gyre that would work. Just same feelings sacrificing it like using a mp40.

Any thoughts or recommendations appreciated.

Thanks for your in depth response. I didn't comment on every point. Yet I assure you no word in any response I get goes unread or considered.

Greatful for any advice, and not to proud to be offended if I'm told I'm being a idiot by someone who knows better lol.
 
Thank you for sharing. That is a rough stretch you went through.
It definitely was. Previously I have only lost two pairs of clowns in the previous 2.5 years since starting the tanks - killed by a six line before getting my maroon clowns. Now I'm in love with the evil maroons and have 3 pairs.

So loosing fish back to back hurt in such a short time. Greatful that I haven't lost any fish since those 3 occurrences. Hopefully this helps others as well. Both Bad and good things happen in this hobby. Yet it's always hard to bring up the bad. So hopefully the information here helps others as well.
 
I saw one article said they can tolerate copper power but not the other types. In addtion I saw a utuber treating one.

Of course I won't go off a single non expert online source/ video Without more research.

Maybe I need to see if Kenny has time to chat . Yet I will plan to specifically research each individual fish. As of now the puffer has it the worst. Still eating but it's concerning.
They take fresh water baths exceedingly well
 
They take fresh water baths exceedingly well
I've never done one before. Should I ?

Do I just net him out the tank and put him in a bucket of heated rodi and For how long?

Or is there more that I would need to consider?

He would be easy to catch he follows me around. The others would be a nightmare.
 
Back
Top