Is there a possibility this doser is allowing a siphon?
- Thread starter Invictus
- Start date
Is the side that doses out of the water ? I’ve ran two of those for 10-15 years. Never noticed that. But anything is possible in this hobby
The dosing line is above the water level and also above the bottom of the dosing container.
The only other explanation is that the power strip is not turning it off at the scheduled time. But after the 2nd time this happened I completely changed to a different power strip in another location, so for it to be accidentally turned on (or not turn off) on 3 occasions seems improbable
How are you controlling the power strip, and what kind? I'd be suspicious of that personally. I've considered dosing it myself numerous times, but I've decided I don't trust they're designed to be that precise.
If it's a kasa strip with the on/off control directly managed on the device I'd be slightly less afraid. If it was a tasmota/esphome flashed device (eg a sonoff plug flashed with that firmware) I'd probably be cool with it.
Ignoring the timer, that pump has two rollers. The more rollers the more precise, though usually the lower amounts it can pump. The more rollers also the lower chances of it allowing liquid/air to flow when it's not running. Presumably it could siphon if the dosed liquid is at the same level or higher than the end of the hose.
If the dosed liquid is lower though, it shouldn't siphon. I'd expect to see normally there be air bubbles in the line after it sits idle for awhile if it's not fully holding pressure.
I am using a Kasa smart strip timer, set to turn on at 4 different times during the day, and then off 1 minute later.
I have been getting a bubble in the line. Right below the output side of the doser. It was about an inch long but didn’t seem to affect the dosing rate.
That bubble is important. It means the pump is leaking, at least slightly, while off. With an ideal peristaltic pump, if you pumped until it has no air left in the line and then turn it off, it would indefinitely hold as if time had frozen. When you turn it on days/months later, it'd still be exactly as it was before, about to drip again. In reality they're not that perfect, and some leakage occurs. However, if you're seeing it have a bubble despite running it 4 times a day, it's leaking a lot.
What type of pump is that?
Average case that means one side drips out slowly into the tank and the other dosing container side drains back into the container. That tends to lead to erratic dosing, since sometimes it's pushing bubbles out, sometimes it's pushing liquid out.
If the dosing container is above the place it's dumping into, it seems plausible it's siphoning.
Regardless if it's the Kasa or the pump, I'd recommend trying to fix the pump. I'd pull the tube and see if it looks highly beaten up or worse case ripped/cracked; if so, replace it. Barring that, not sure there's much to do outside of getting a different design. There's a different thread where people are mentioning the jebao dosers are on sale for around $60. I'd personally trust those more than a kasa outlet and 2-roller pump that's draining that much.
One more question, if the pump was running at full speed, with all the lines fully primed, how long would you expect it to take to dump your full container?
thephoreefer
Supporting Member
Have u try installing check valve?this what I use on my doser tube to not have the dosing liquid go back. Works great if u have check valve.
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I thought about setting OFF parameters on the Kasa strip every 10 minutes or so, in the event of user error, but never did.
I just don’t see how I could have accidentally turned it on, hence the question about potential siphoning.
If the container was full it would take ~4 hours to dump the whole thing. After the 2nd time this happened, I started only filling it half way or less in case of another issue.
I thought about setting OFF parameters on the Kasa strip every 10 minutes or so, in the event of user error, but never did.
I just don’t see how I could have accidentally turned it on, hence the question about potential siphoning.
Sorry but if by “water line” you are referring to the water in the sump, that is not correct. If the end of the output tubing is below the liquid level in the dosing reservoir it could potentially siphon. The output end does not need to be in the water in your sump for it to happen.
I’m only calling this out because it is a common misconception and a very important distinction. Not understanding this could give one a false sense of security in your setup and a nasty surprise.
Thanks for the help everyone.
Seeing as the dosing output is is ~6” higher than the dosing container itself, I guess it’s improbable (impossible?) that it would have completely emptied due to a siphon.
The most likely scenario seems to be that the Kasa powerstrip port is somehow being tripped on, either by my user error or by some fault of the electronics/app.
Frustrating, because there’s no way for me to figure out how it’s happening, and 3 times now is just unacceptable. Maybe it’s time to pony up for a more reliable dosing pump with built in scheduling.
Seeing as the dosing output is is ~6” higher than the dosing container itself, I guess it’s improbable (impossible?) that it would have completely emptied due to a siphon.
The most likely scenario seems to be that the Kasa powerstrip port is somehow being tripped on, either by my user error or by some fault of the electronics/app.
Frustrating, because there’s no way for me to figure out how it’s happening, and 3 times now is just unacceptable. Maybe it’s time to pony up for a more reliable dosing pump with built in scheduling.
Klems
Supporting Member
Looks like a BRS branded pump. They do sell replacement parts for those pumps
This is another stretch, but does your kasa have power monitoring? I don't know if a dosing pump uses enough to register, but you could potentially see how much energy it used after it's gone awry.
What got dosed btw? Did it crash your system?
And you're sure it dosed into the system? There's not a leak somewhere and it dumped out?
I'd also try contacting BRS. My guess is they'll ask you to check all the connections are secure (that's the most likely place you're losing pressure and it's later causing the air bubble and leaking) and have you replace the tubing in the pump.
Put a cup under the outlet. Then on a day that your free. Check the dose times. Empty the cup each time Then you’ll have your answer if the timer is correct. Leave it for 24 hours after the last dose time. Just in case it doses again.
It dumped All For Reef, which slowly raises the alkalinity very high, 13.2 DKH yesterday. It has never killed anything, but the pain is trying to quickly yet slowly lower the alkalinity back to normal range before anything is majorly affected. I did a 25% water change yesterday and will measure again when I’m home later today.
I did that prior to set up, and again, after the first issue I had. It seems to dose very consistently. So this is either a random malfunction every couple months, or just user error by me tripping it on somehow.
Daymn. Guess just place the pump higher than the container. And the outlet higher than the container too.
Chromis
Supporting Member
That’s ok. It’s the output line, it will empty partially or even fully if your line output is above the water line. Mine looks the same.