Jestersix

Mike's newest disaster...

As a comparison, my quote from Keith for a 60/30/24, 3 pane star fire, coast to coast overflow, external box, bean animal overflow n 2 returns, was $2375.


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Wlachnit said:
It was about $2700. They were the least expensive quote for a custom tank. I had it drilled for four 3/4" bulkhead returns and two 20" Synergy Reef overflows. I wanted more linear return than just one 20" box. So, I plumbed one of them to the other and setup one BeanAnimal. I have a ton of flow...which is great. (My old Truvu had two corner overflows that were undersized with one hole.) Had I known about Modular Marine's 33" overflow, I would have gone with that. (Although, it appears that their website has been down...since they are too busy?...a bit odd)

If I remember correctly from my college calculus days (30y ago), the width shouldn't impact the pressure on the glass? Isn't it always about the height? I guess they would know.

Here is the rendering of mine. Not sure how to just post a pic.

-Will
Click to expand...
Wow that is easily $1000 more than what they quoted me, for less holes too, and it would have definitely be an option for me had that been the quote . How long ago was this tank built?

And yes height increases pressure, but with larger panes it doesn't take as much for to add deflection, which is the real problem with tanks, the strength of the glass is more than perfectly fine, but the seams are what hold it all together and prevent thinks like leaking.
 
That said, got the preliminary schedule for next semester and the cuts don't look good. So might have to put this project on hold for a bit. Fricking knew I was jinxing things by starting this thread so early.
 
sfsuphysics said:
Wow that is easily $1000 more than what they quoted me, for less holes too, and it would have definitely be an option for me had that been the quote . How long ago was this tank built?

And yes height increases pressure, but with larger panes it doesn't take as much for to add deflection, which is the real problem with tanks, the strength of the glass is more than perfectly fine, but the seams are what hold it all together and prevent thinks like leaking.
Click to expand...

Your quote was for <$1700 ? Was that an 8ft tank? It was built earlier this summer.
-Will
 
Bummer on the work situation.
Well, less work = more time to DIY a tank. :rolleyes:

Note: "Starphire" glass is not magical. Any low-iron glass will do, and likely be a whole lot cheaper.

Some physics for the other posts:
Length affects "total overall" pressure on glass linearly.
That overall pressure must be held by all the seams. Top+Bottom+Left+Right.
But as the tank gets longer, the top and bottom seams get longer as well, so
the amount held by the left/right ends diminishes in comparison to top and bottom.
Thus, length is not as important for glass thickness on larger tanks, but it does matter.
 
Wlachnit said:
Your quote was for <$1700 ? Was that an 8ft tank? It was built earlier this summer.
-Will
Click to expand...
sorry, too early, not enough caffeine this morning. I mean my quote was $1000 more

One of the earlier emails

Our head designer says a 96x30x24 with 1/2" glass is possible when enhanced with extra safety features: double overlapping euro brace, tempered bottom, additional bottom brace, reinforced seams. With all these elements, the price of the tank in 1/2" (2 panels Starphire) would be $3,741.
Using 3/4" thick glass, a 96x30x24 with your specifications would be $5,645.
Click to expand...

A bit later on
No worries, I understand your desire to maximize the volume of your aquarium while also not breaking the bank. I spoke with Trent and he said he would be able to do a 96x30x24 with a 3/4" bottom and 1/2" sides. Plus a 1/2" brace on the bottom, and double stacked eurobrace on the top and reinforced seams.
Based on those specs, the estimate would be $3,940.
Click to expand...

Now this exchange confused me a bunch almost like they don't even remember having this conversation with me earlier even though she quoted the entire series of emails we've been having.

I'm guessing they simply want to maximize the safety factor of the situation and they do not use 5/8" (15mm) glass so it's either 1/2" (which from what I recall would leave a SF of 3.7) or 3/4 which is like way more.
 
rygh said:
Bummer on the work situation.
Well, less work = more time to DIY a tank. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
Yeah we'll have to see about that, the dept head is still trying to get the classes restored but I don't have a lot of hope for that honestly they are fairly low enrolled classes, such is the problem of not being a tenured instructor I am not guaranteed to have a full work load, I love having lots of time off (summers, winters, etc) but it really feels like a lottery each semester to see if I'll end up having the same income, and the big thing I worry about is losing my health insurance. Doubly sucks too because we just signed a new contract and we're getting something like a 9.6% raise.

But strangely enough it's not the price of the tank that I'm that concerned about (ok, a little bit concerned), it's the overall long term maintenance, heck I'm expecting the electric bill to pop up as it gets colder downstairs (one of the reasons to get an insulated fishroom up), and less sun hitting my solar panels, I excpet my $5-20 electric bill to closer to $100-$150/month, which I realize in the grand scheme of things isn't too bad for a 270g tank that's currently there, but still. This is one of those cases where I wish I had the free time now, to actually finish up the construction of the ROOM aspect down there, as it stands having 2-3 hours free a day really doesn't bode well for me, maybe I'll try to redouble my efforts in getting things done even if it's a matter of 1 or 2 beams each day.

Note: "Starphire" glass is not magical. Any low-iron glass will do, and likely be a whole lot cheaper.
Click to expand...
Yeah I realize that, I and I'm sure many others, use that word like people say they need a Kleenex. The "cheap" quote I have they specifically use the term low-iron glass, where as all the more expensive quotes have used "Starphire"

Some physics for the other posts:
Length affects "total overall" pressure on glass linearly.
That overall pressure must be held by all the seams. Top+Bottom+Left+Right.
But as the tank gets longer, the top and bottom seams get longer as well, so
the amount held by the left/right ends diminishes in comparison to top and bottom.
Thus, length is not as important for glass thickness on larger tanks, but it does matter.
Click to expand...
Ok the instructor aspect in me is cringing. The pressure does not change with length, pressure is a force per unit area, however as your area increases with length the total force that is applied increases, which I'm sure is what you were trying to say. The upside of the one company is the metal top doesn't rely on the silicone holding against it for it's strength unlike a eurobrace, which might be why that company is more willing to stick with 1/2"
 
sfsuphysics said:
Ok the instructor aspect in me is cringing. The pressure does not change with length, pressure is a force per unit area, however as your area increases with length the total force that is applied increases, which I'm sure is what you were trying to say. The upside of the one company is the metal top doesn't rely on the silicone holding against it for it's strength unlike a eurobrace, which might be why that company is more willing to stick with 1/2"
Click to expand...

Yeah, now I am embarrassed. Correct, I meant overall total force.

Amusingly: Technically, tank temperature and salinity affect pressure way more than length.
 
So I will throw a different idea out there - Get TWO mid size tanks.
You can have two very different biotopes. An ultimate SPS, a FOWLR, a predator tank, or any variation you want.
And only do one for now.
 
Or I can continue what I said that was option 1, use the 8' x 3' x 1.5' acrylic (bleh) tank I already have, put some effort into it to make it a bit show worthy... as could as can humanly be done, and then when the circumstances change replace it with the same footprint in glass, just a bit taller.

I'll have to see.
 
sfsuphysics said:
Or I can continue what I said that was option 1, use the 8' x 3' x 1.5' acrylic (bleh) tank I already have, put some effort into it to make it a bit show worthy... as could as can humanly be done, and then when the circumstances change replace it with the same footprint in glass, just a bit taller.

I'll have to see.
Click to expand...
+1 on that idea.
Acrylic does have its advantages. Clarity, insulation, weight, earthquake resistance, longevity of joints.
For a small percentage of the new tank cost you can even hire someone to buff out the scratches.
 
one of my biggest worries though is at only 18" high it might get rather lost as an "in wall" number. I mean sure I can have a little seating area/bar top in front of it but still loses a bit of that appeal of height.
 
sfsuphysics said:
Had to think about what this meant for a second, I was thinking A.G.E. is 2-3x or 2-3k? I could do 2-3k :D Tank will be downstairs so hopefully the baby gate will hold him out, and then yeah locks if necessary.

As for stand I originally wanted a steel one, but putting price consideration into things I think wood would be cheaper (don't have welding equipment so that would be an added cost... plus kinda certain that takes a bit of skill :D), I can be happy with a 3 foot span without any supports in the middle, most of the weight is going to be carried on the main 8' long rails (beams).

Lighting may not be as expensive as you think, IMO heating it is my largest concern, when I had my 375 + 270g sump the electric bill was quite high in the winter (lack of solar production) compared to the month of July (no 375g tank anymore but still the 270) and my electric bill was like $6 for the month. I haven't decided what to do with lighting, however I am a firm believer than the entire tank does not need to be uniformly lit. I have some metal halides, I have some T5 setups (no bulbs other than actinic though), I have some DIY LED setups, I might do a little of each just temporary up to kind of see what I like best before committing to anything, I do have an idea in mind for what overall effect I want though.
Click to expand...

Mike,

I have some retro fit T5's (a couple of 4' & 5') with bulbs you are welcome to have. I agree with the points Kris and Mark made. If the tank is going downstairs...just use what you have and see if Denzil can polish it for you...you won't be disappointed. Think of all the corals you can buy with all the money you will save. ;)
 
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Comes to mind that there's a member here who is a welder; I mentioned him that some of the people here might be interested in getting a steel stand.

BTW I see you are challenging gimmito on the number of pages of the thread, keep the pace; I'm sure a lot of us can contribute to defeat his record breaking tank journal.
 
Yup I know about the welder thanks :)

And I started the thread saying this was going to be a Gimmito style tank journal thread :)

Thanks Jim, I'll take you up on that offer I'm sure... well as soon as things are ready to be setup. As to the polishing, I also need to make sure I get all those aiptasia molecules off the sides from where they're growing too tank is a little too big to fill with bleach
 
You can lay it on the several sides and use paper towels soaked with bleach, then flip it and the other side; that's how I remove calcium on tanks; with vinegar of course.
 
Ok, so all that bleached and acidified rock I did 2 weeks ago, I peeked into the container that it's cycling/cooking in. It's been a while since I've cycled that much rock at all once, although the last time it was "live" rock, and it was smelling quite horrible This stuff not so much, so for kicks and giggles I decided to test the ammonia levels.

oCu06Id.jpg

Good lord, it's darker than the highest reading on the card! I'm guessing I killed a sizable amount of stuff on the rocks that never did leave the rocks. Overall though I'm sure I'm building up quite the bacterial load on it :D

Pretty much was the same time the first time I did this (although I did it in a tank in my living room... lets just say it's a good thing I wasn't married then!)
 
Ok a week later and the same level of ammonia... geeze!

I did notice that the card I have is for the freshwater version of ammonia, and looking online at the saltwater version the color does match up with the very last level on that, which is 10.0 ppm. I'm wondering how much crap is still on there dying though, a quick look online shows the ammonia part of the cycle should last 2 weeks before trickling off, wonder if the temperature is the issue since I don't have a heater in there, so it's basically in the 50-60 degree range instead of 70-80. The thing is the vat of rocks do not smell at all like that first time I cycle nasty dead rocks (over 10 years ago)
 
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