Hobby Costs; Can they be lower?
- Thread starter Blaise006
- Start date
Remember a lot of stores have to abide by MAP so they can't mess with pricing on a lot of hardware/supplies.
The biggest concern I have for the hobby is that the same company buying up Ecotech/AI/Neptune (Aka Bertram capital). Much like you see with other industries with little competition, price increases will be unavoidable when one big company owns them all.
Old school reefers still have success with a modified Berlin method with just a few pieces of extra equipment. Take advantage of the club's DTBC and frag swaps to keep your coral costs down. Adopt fish and buy tank raised. Borrow club equipment where you can. Pay it forward for anything sitting in your garage like @Prestondeeply said research and buy the right thing first.
Look into solar if you can. The new tax credit is pretty nice!
The biggest concern I have for the hobby is that the same company buying up Ecotech/AI/Neptune (Aka Bertram capital). Much like you see with other industries with little competition, price increases will be unavoidable when one big company owns them all.
Old school reefers still have success with a modified Berlin method with just a few pieces of extra equipment. Take advantage of the club's DTBC and frag swaps to keep your coral costs down. Adopt fish and buy tank raised. Borrow club equipment where you can. Pay it forward for anything sitting in your garage like @Prestondeeply said research and buy the right thing first.
Look into solar if you can. The new tax credit is pretty nice!
I didn’t realize there was one company buying up neptune/ecotech et al. Hmm. I do see a few more European companies doing more distribution in the US so hopefully there will be more competition/technology
Kensington Reefer
Supporting Member
Back in the early 2000’s central pet swallowed all-glass/oceanic aquariums, coralife, and seachem
prices never go down
but quality always seems to
sad…
prices never go down
but quality always seems to
sad…
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BAYMAC
Guest
We saw a big changes in All-Glass and Oceanic back then. I was bummed to see Oceanic go away, their 30g cube was awesome, and built like a tank.
I remember that. Hella long time ago. People made a big fuss about it too.
Brs carries glass cages now. Back in the day. They were junk. Now people think they are all that and a bag of chips. Makes me wonder, did their quality get better or did our standards get lower.
CaptainB
Supporting Member
For people who want solar but haven't been paying attention, be aware they passed the new net metering.
If you want the old metering rates (you do) the project needs to start by April 1 I believe. I think that just means to apply for permits. But yeah, gotta get moving.
Blaise006
Supporting Member
It’s the roof costs that are the deterrent for my case right now. Replacing the roof for solar, and then replacing it again in a few years to improve the upstairs is making the decision a bit more nuanced.
CaptainB
Supporting Member
Aye. I tried to get solar last year but my roof was too old. Thankfully I was in a position to get the roof done, but now I'm trying to scrape a solar project together.It’s the roof costs that are the deterrent for my case right now. Replacing the roof for solar, and then replacing it again in a few years to improve the upstairs is making the decision a bit more nuanced.
CaptainB
Supporting Member
But to get back on track I think there's some social media aspect to reefkeeping these days that wasn't always present. Especially among people like us who frequent forums etc.
Do people really need every new gadget and the best of the best? No, but what else are you going to post on the internet? The companies know this and play into it with their uber fancy offerings where everything has an app and Bluetooth.
I'm guilty of it at times too, I try to do a reality check: do I, personally, actually like x expensive product or coral better than y cheap one? Would someone not so engrossed in the hobby notice the difference?
More rare doesn't mean better, other reef dorks thinking features are cool doesn't mean this reef dork actually needs them.
Do people really need every new gadget and the best of the best? No, but what else are you going to post on the internet? The companies know this and play into it with their uber fancy offerings where everything has an app and Bluetooth.
I'm guilty of it at times too, I try to do a reality check: do I, personally, actually like x expensive product or coral better than y cheap one? Would someone not so engrossed in the hobby notice the difference?
More rare doesn't mean better, other reef dorks thinking features are cool doesn't mean this reef dork actually needs them.
I like the solar idea but every solar company I talked to, I feel like the scam me. lol . So far three company I spoke to, each system will cost $30k plus..
On the reef things, main equipments that you must have if you can get them used they don't not cost much, you properly get half price on the MPA price. The high cost is corals price.
Blaise006
Supporting Member
Agreed on the solar companies.
Kensington Reefer
Supporting Member
I have one of those cubes!
Waiting for the right time...
Arvin R
Supporting Member
Just the contract needs to be signed by April 1st (work does not need to start by then) I am definitely going to get it going. Do you have a company you would recommend? Deciding in what company has been my hardest set back as I can't get clear cut information on one vs another.It’s the roof costs that are the deterrent for my case right now. Replacing the roof for solar, and then replacing it again in a few years to improve the upstairs is making the decision a bit more nuanced.
rygh
Guest
One thing many people do not realize : Over-filling your tank with livestock really increases expense!
If you have a fairly open tank, lots of extra water, lots of live rock, and a smaller set of fish and coral,
you can run almost everything naturally.
No need for endless fancy equipment.
It makes a BIG difference.
As far as energy costs:
Almost all the equipment these days runs on 24V DC.
Look at all those little power supplies connected to pumps and everything.
A lot of RV solar and batteries can run 24V (with 2 batteries) and has 3 way input (solar/generator/AC)
A lot of work, but eliminates PGE except on cloudy days.
If you have a fairly open tank, lots of extra water, lots of live rock, and a smaller set of fish and coral,
you can run almost everything naturally.
No need for endless fancy equipment.
It makes a BIG difference.
As far as energy costs:
Almost all the equipment these days runs on 24V DC.
Look at all those little power supplies connected to pumps and everything.
A lot of RV solar and batteries can run 24V (with 2 batteries) and has 3 way input (solar/generator/AC)
A lot of work, but eliminates PGE except on cloudy days.
RandyC
Supporting Member
Agreed. You can survive (and thrive!) simply with a HOB filter, a power head, heater or two and inexpensive lights. That’s it. No need for controller, skimmer, UV light, algae reactor. I’d consider an ATO, but you can build one for $30 if you really wanna be budget. Also an Aquatic Life RO/DI is a good investment for smaller systems instead of having to go buy water. And if you wanna splurge, a Ranco controller to protect you from heat mishaps. Even with all that, you could set up a successful 40 gallon breeder for under $500 - probably less.
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Solar companies are scams. Diy off grid is the way to go. Think of it as Just another hobby. You need a lot of solar panels to make any decent power tho. Well at least in San Francisco.
rygh
Guest
I don't think the solar companies are the big problem, other than upselling.
It is really PGE and the whole way grid attached billing is done.
Agree : DIY and taking your tank almost completely off grid is the way to go.
Solar electric for the equipment.
Solar water for the heating.
But that is no small amount of work.
We should have a <$500 BAR tank challenge!