Need Champions and Ideas to make use of the BAR funds

[VacavilleFC]

The line I'm caught upon is non profit. So far our views have all but been focused internally. Non profits typically attempt to reach beyond their own membership or in otherwords invested people.

I think something we can do externally is show how we promote mariculture in the coral community.

I recently saw there is a commission in SF advocating to ban live animal sales including fish within the city. I wonder if there's some sort of outreach we could do to show how maricultured fish and coral is ethical, and in turn it might convince LFS to buy maricultured over wild caught specimens rather than being shut down completely.

Good idea we already have a thread for 3d printed request. Not sure the price on materials used to print. Yet I could see merit in offsetting the costs of making things for members.

I have never had a 3d printer. Yet I would easily envision there is a slight learning curve to using these things over a basic computer printer. In terms of troubleshooting issues that maybe obvious to someone experienced with 3d printing. So not really sure I would consider 3d printers own by the club a solid idea. Granted I'm ignorant in this area and could easily be over thinking this.

However I think it would be cool to have a basic workshop on 3d printing in general would be super beneficial and educational to those of us who wouldn't even know how to turn them on unless it clearly said on/off on the button lol, let along actually set one of these up to print something.

I've seen many 3d printers on market place for under $100 even. So I would be inclined to trying this out if I was a little more informed about the process, and differences in printers, printing materials, what's reef safe and what isn't, and how to find cool stuff to print that you didn't know existed. If anyone with printers and some knowledge on this would be open to teaching some basics let me know any maybe we can plan it as a future club event.

material price is negligible a roll of petg( the type of filament that is reef safe) is $12-15 a kilogram which can do ALOT of prints depending on the size of the object for example holder for a single frag plug holder is only a couple grams or the frag rack I printed was somewhere around 50grams

having a basic basic workshop on them wouldn't be difficult but it would take the better part of a day. but the problem is the steps you use and software vary from printer to printer. and some printers arent even capable of printing petg because of its high melting point. those cheap printers you see for sale like ender3 probably dont even have auto bed leveling which is a total PITA and would need to be done every couple prints or everytime the printer is moved. then there's wear items like nozzles and extruder gears.

if you wanna look up 3d models you can download for free go to thingiverse.com


I personally dont think it would be a good investment for the club to buy a printer.

i have no issues printing anything the club wants.

 

[MichaelB]

I recently saw there is a commission in SF advocating to ban live animal sales including fish within the city. I wonder if there's some sort of outreach we could do to show how maricultured fish and coral is ethical, and in turn it might convince LFS to buy maricultured over wild caught specimens rather than being shut down completely.

material price is negligible a roll of petg( the type of filament that is reef safe) is $12-15 a kilogram which can do ALOT of prints depending on the size of the object for example holder for a single frag plug holder is only a couple grams or the frag rack I printed was somewhere around 50grams

having a basic basic workshop on them wouldn't be difficult but it would take the better part of a day. but the problem is the steps you use and software vary from printer to printer. and some printers arent even capable of printing petg because of its high melting point. those cheap printers you see for sale like ender3 probably dont even have auto bed leveling which is a total PITA and would need to be done every couple prints or everytime the printer is moved. then there's wear items like nozzles and extruder gears.

if you wanna look up 3d models you can download for free go to thingiverse.com


I personally dont think it would be a good investment for the club to buy a printer.

i have no issues printing anything the club wants.

Lol good thing I didn't buy a cheap one. I was saying to myself mentally I see so many of that type advertised as like new they must suck in some way.

 

[VacavilleFC]

Lol good thing I didn't buy a cheap one. I was saying to myself mentally I see so many of that type advertised as like new they must suck in some way.

not that it would be un-usable the learning curve is just far steeper. they went from cheap ones being something you needed to tinker with constantly to being decently reliable in the last few years. as much as I hate bambu labs printers for being a closed eco system they pushed the open source companies like prusa and flashforge to innovate and make better affordable printers. its sorta like apple vs android.

I can teach you how to jailbreak an android and install a new OS, but i couldn't even tell you how to delete a file on a apple product

 

[Coral reefer]

I recently saw there is a commission in SF advocating to ban live animal sales including fish within the city. I wonder if there's some sort of outreach we could do to show how maricultured fish and coral is ethical, and in turn it might convince LFS to buy maricultured over wild caught specimens rather than being shut down completely.

material price is negligible a roll of petg( the type of filament that is reef safe) is $12-15 a kilogram which can do ALOT of prints depending on the size of the object for example holder for a single frag plug holder is only a couple grams or the frag rack I printed was somewhere around 50grams

having a basic basic workshop on them wouldn't be difficult but it would take the better part of a day. but the problem is the steps you use and software vary from printer to printer. and some printers arent even capable of printing petg because of its high melting point. those cheap printers you see for sale like ender3 probably dont even have auto bed leveling which is a total PITA and would need to be done every couple prints or everytime the printer is moved. then there's wear items like nozzles and extruder gears.

if you wanna look up 3d models you can download for free go to thingiverse.com


I personally dont think it would be a good investment for the club to buy a printer.

i have no issues printing anything the club wants.

There’s a lfs in SF?

 

[VacavilleFC]

There’s a lfs in SF?

several according to Google.

 

[Alexander1312]

There’s a lfs in SF?

several according to Google.

According to my google, only this infamous 6th ave place. So a moot point unless this ban extends to other areas in the bay area.

 

[spuri87]

According to my google

Did you check with other AI applications?

 

[Alexander1312]

Did you check with other AI applications?

Gemini fan boy here (but I do allow Claude his first place).

 

[MichaelB]

According to my google, only this infamous 6th ave place. So a moot point unless this ban extends to other areas in the bay area.

That place needs to be shut down. And criminal charges filled ugh. I wouldn't be in favor of a total ban for sf even though I'm over 50 miles from there and it wouldn't personally effect me. That store though only been once but was beyond disturbing to me.

 

[Alexander1312]

That place needs to be shut down. And criminal charges filled ugh. I wouldn't be in favor of a total ban for sf even though I'm over 50 miles from there and it wouldn't personally effect me. That store though only been once but was beyond disturbing to me.

Maybe this is an area where we should put our funds to advocate for this business to shut down, which would be in line with our mission.

 

[spuri87]

That place needs to be shut down. And criminal charges filled ugh. I wouldn't be in favor of a total ban for sf even though I'm over 50 miles from there and it wouldn't personally effect me. That store though only been once but was beyond disturbing to me.

After reading so many bad reviews, I really want to check it out once to see how can they manage to offend so many marine enthusiasts in the same era!

 

[Coral reefer]

Maybe this is an area where we should put our funds to advocate for this business to shut down, which would be in line with our mission.

If I thought there was a way to make a difference I would agree. I don’t think we could really have an impact. But you never know unless you try!

 

[MichaelB]

If I thought there was a way to make a difference I would agree. I don’t think we could really have an impact. But you never know unless you try!

@Alexander1312


I wouldn't be against something like that. However always the chance for unintended consequences ie. That store and it habits/ practices makes the news, and somehow becomes the focus (image people see and think of) of anti sea life movement. Not saying likely but it could have potential to spread beyond its intended effect of targeting a single store. What if it somehow effected the perception of other reputable LFS or area hobbyist as a whole. That store is bad enough I could see it literally being on the news if the right people saw it.

I honestly wish there was some type of regulation entity that would inspect there methods force them to change or shut down.

When I think of bag sales that place is what's stuck in my head of course I haven't been in hobby I. This area as long as others. Yet I've never seen anything even approaching that level out right profit over care of animals, in any other Lfs petcos included.

 

[FinalPhaze987]

You guys ever watch that episode of the Simpsons where Homer buys Marge a bowling ball for her birthday? I can't help but recall that as I read this thread.

Expensive equipment, albeit shared, isn't justified with our $30 / year membership. How many ACTIVE supporting members do we have? The math ain't mathing.

Back on topic, I feel we need to think beyond the "what's in it for me" and change the narrative back to "what's in it for the mission of BAR?"

I really like the suggestions @robert4025 made in an earlier thread somewhere in setting up workshops and educational resources for newer reefers. I see common newbie questions pushed to the wayside or answered with only 1 viewpoint on here, and think that to promote our mission it begins with teaching future generations how to live that mission. What does ethical and sustainable reefkeeping mean to us? That way when I'm too old to keep a tank and I log into BAR in 2056, we can see that same mission living through the active membership.

We have teachers on this forum that involve their students in our hobby. Why are they not better supported? Again, their students will be the next generation to carry the torch.

How about a beach clean up? It might not be a reef, but this is our home. Arranging a clean up at Alameda beach or SF Tidepools can be arranged and fund used for burgers and dogs to be BBQ after. Something like that makes for a good bonding experience and puts faces to these handles. Have it open to all, not just members. We need to broaden our reach and expand our community. Show them we are willing to invest in it.

Hell, what if we signed up for a 4 hour shift at the food bank? Break up into 2 teams to see who can pack the most food in that shift. Winners get some sort of spo sorted prize or a bonus ticket for a swap...something of that nature. We'll feed 1000's of families in the process. One i know personally that was a former BAR members who had to take his system down after some tough financial struggles during COVID.

Guest speakers are great. I think they give good viewpoints and serve as something that can attract more people to BAR that showcases what sets us apart from a reddit thread. QT practices, biome education, basic reefing like what Logan has on his channel, I think all of that would be great for people to partake in.

There are alot of us on here that are very experienced hobbyists. For those who have been around, I know there are some who would lean in on the idea that in order for us to sustain and grow, we need to invest in the future of this community rather than a fancy piece of equipment that is added to barcode. We're a reefing community, not a reefing rent a center.

Go from the Simpsons to Field of Dreams.

If we build it, they will come.

 

[MolaMola]

We have teachers on this forum that involve their students in our hobby. Why are they not better supported? Again, their students will be the next generation to carry the torch.

As a teacher, I think this is a huge and meaningful goal. People here with kids give them broad, enriching experiences. You would be shocked at how many kids are not exposed to much at all, engage in no extracurricular activities, and are living a frighteningly large part of their lives digitally, but in ways that limit them instead of expanding their horizons. If we want to promote environmental stewardship, we have to expose more kids to the wonders of nature and offer them ways to participate. Some years ago, some groups in California came up with a pretty solid framework to include ocean/aquatic science in all grades K-12, which was then left out of both revised national and state ed standards - very disappointing.

I feel very supported by BAR, though sadly I have been/still am not very active bc for people super into teaching like me, it is very hard to keep one's head above water, even if you love water. BAR buddies have offered me equipment, livestock, help, and encouragement. If I can get my act together more, I could use help, but a lot of times I am just too busy and other tasks are more pressing. Recently, @Coral reefer helped me out a lot with my classroom tanks and boosted my morale without any negative comments on tank neglect and such (thank you). Who else boosted me in the past? Charlie Veron, godfather of the Great Barrier Reef who spoke at MACNA in Las Vegas some years ago and believes all classrooms should have an aquarium. His book is great for teachers bc we have so many students who do not appear strong according to school stats but we know are amazing young people. It would be interesting to hear (NOT in this thread) how BAR members got interested in reefkeeping and/or the ocean.

I would love for more classrooms to have tanks and wish I knew about freshwater bc supposedly that can be easier to manage. Years ago I was part of a research project trying some computer and lab activities and went to a workshop of all the partners at Penn State. The project had nothing to do with marine science, but I got to hang out with the welcoming Sanjay Joshi while there, who also said classrooms need tanks. Over the years I have become a queen of obtaining classroom funding and along the way found out that Pennsylvania and Maryland had some extraordinary reefs-in-schools programs, with help from local club-type people. New York has the Billion Oyster Project in which schools can participate. In the Bay Area, Trout in the Classroom still offers a solid program I think - in my area the local flyfishing club sponsored it. These types of programs directly impact kids in ways they always remember. I was able to make some personal classroom reef tank partners across the country through a particular funding source, then WHAM - Covid school closures ended all that, most no longer teach, and my last partner shut down his tank last semester.

If I have time this summer (which is ~7 weeks not including all the tasks to be done during that time, not the 3 months people tell me I have off) I will make more progress on my tank rehabs. What I think would be cool is if I offered a little info session/workshop about the whys and hows of keeping a classroom aquarium to either my large school district, schools served by my county office of ed, or the wildly motivated teachers of the Exploratorium Teacher Institute who are spread out everywhere (those are my peeps, though I have also been inactive there). I know that in BAR at least @Michael Hans @Coral reefer @Kensington Reefer have experience with connecting kids at all grade levels with tanks in schools.

*** TLDR: I think some BAR funds and expertise would have a meaningful impact through aquariums in classrooms. Or maybe school visits. ***

 

[spuri87]

You guys ever watch that episode of the Simpsons where Homer buys Marge a bowling ball for her birthday? I can't help but recall that as I read this thread.

Expensive equipment, albeit shared, isn't justified with our $30 / year membership. How many ACTIVE supporting members do we have? The math ain't mathing.

Back on topic, I feel we need to think beyond the "what's in it for me" and change the narrative back to "what's in it for the mission of BAR?"

I really like the suggestions @robert4025 made in an earlier thread somewhere in setting up workshops and educational resources for newer reefers. I see common newbie questions pushed to the wayside or answered with only 1 viewpoint on here, and think that to promote our mission it begins with teaching future generations how to live that mission. What does ethical and sustainable reefkeeping mean to us? That way when I'm too old to keep a tank and I log into BAR in 2056, we can see that same mission living through the active membership.

We have teachers on this forum that involve their students in our hobby. Why are they not better supported? Again, their students will be the next generation to carry the torch.

How about a beach clean up? It might not be a reef, but this is our home. Arranging a clean up at Alameda beach or SF Tidepools can be arranged and fund used for burgers and dogs to be BBQ after. Something like that makes for a good bonding experience and puts faces to these handles. Have it open to all, not just members. We need to broaden our reach and expand our community. Show them we are willing to invest in it.

Hell, what if we signed up for a 4 hour shift at the food bank? Break up into 2 teams to see who can pack the most food in that shift. Winners get some sort of spo sorted prize or a bonus ticket for a swap...something of that nature. We'll feed 1000's of families in the process. One i know personally that was a former BAR members who had to take his system down after some tough financial struggles during COVID.

Guest speakers are great. I think they give good viewpoints and serve as something that can attract more people to BAR that showcases what sets us apart from a reddit thread. QT practices, biome education, basic reefing like what Logan has on his channel, I think all of that would be great for people to partake in.

There are alot of us on here that are very experienced hobbyists. For those who have been around, I know there are some who would lean in on the idea that in order for us to sustain and grow, we need to invest in the future of this community rather than a fancy piece of equipment that is added to barcode. We're a reefing community, not a reefing rent a center.

Go from the Simpsons to Field of Dreams.

If we build it, they will come.

So beautifully put, Sir! Respect! I have always seen you as someone with a lot of wisdom and respect you for sharing a part of your wholesome knowledge with this club. Thank you!

First things first, I want everyone in the club to know the most important aspect that keeps the world rolling - FINANCES! You can't paint your home if you dont know how much money you have in your pocket. BAR has always been transparent with the entire club and shared periodic updates on where we stand with the finances! As of April, 2025 (maybe time to re-do this soon @CaseyP?), BAR had over 30k in cash (up from around 15k back in 2017). The number may have changed now, but everyone, please go through this to know where we stand: https://bareefers.org/forum/threads/bar-financial-statement-2025.38249/

Having 30k in the pocket doesn't mean we can blow it all on cocaine and stuff! We got a Non Profit to run! But seeing this number increase over time with not many efforts taken by the members to make use it for anything to support the club, support its people, support the reefing world outside of BAR and most importantly supporting the BAR's mission, @CaseyP expressed that we need to find new initiatives and Champions to propose new things and drive them home! And that was the origin of this thread, with some proposals from my side on how we can help the supporting members which is again, just one aspect of this whole thing.

As expected, ideas came in from all over the BAR, some requesting some more equipment that will help make everyone's life easier, and some sharing ideas on how we can use the funds to make a bigger impact on the world. This is what this thread is all about.. This is what we wanted people to take time off their busy world to type what they feel will make a difference - a difference to someone's own life, or maybe to a small group people, or maybe to entire BAR community or maybe to the entire reefing community - but a difference nevertheless.. It was never about THIS vs THAT.. it was never about HIM vs HER.. it was about proposing ideas to make a change, coz as they say, change is the only constant.

I am working with @CaseyP and @MichaelB who have shared some feedback on how to improve this idea flow mechanism.. But, one thing everyone should know - these are just IDEAS that may make a change.. EVERYONE should think of such ideas and propose them (in this thread until we formalize the process).. But, we should not forget 2 most important things, these ideas will stay ideas and never become reality unless -

1. BOD approves the idea (big or small, personal or world changing)
2. We find a champion to drive the idea home.

Unfortunately not a lot of us can participate in #1, but ANY of us can participate in #2 and help turn these ideas into reality.. We will soon be proposing these ideas, including some of the wonderful ideas by @FinalPhaze987 but unless we find a driver for that idea, nothing is going to happen.. Let's join hands to make this happen.. It only takes one idea to change the present, and that idea can come from anywhere!

 

[MolaMola]

Another idea that is more like community outreach is setting up and maintaining a tank somewhere that is not a school.
- Long-term care, skilled nursing, or assisted living facility. I have seen tanks at these locations and residents interacted with fish, plant motion, etc. Very stimulating and relaxing.
- A former LFS owner placed some of our green BTAs in a tank at a chemo or dialysis center, and a massive and cool looking Hollywood Stunner Echinopora chalice that grew in a crazy way in a tank at a Kaiser pediatric waiting room.
Just brainstorming.

 

[H2OPlayar]

Another idea that is more like community outreach is setting up and maintaining a tank somewhere that is not a school.
- Long-term care, skilled nursing, or assisted living facility. I have seen tanks at these locations and residents interacted with fish, plant motion, etc. Very stimulating and relaxing.
- A former LFS owner placed some of our green BTAs in a tank at a chemo or dialysis center, and a massive and cool looking Hollywood Stunner Echinopora chalice that grew in a crazy way in a tank at a Kaiser pediatric waiting room.
Just brainstorming.

I kind of did this with the Fiesta Vallarta tank in downtown Los Altos. They were really happy when I was able to help, but I had to move away and the next guy who took over wasn't as good, lol. I like the idea a lot. Maybe take a few systems and set up softie tanks around different locations with a link to us or other resources to help educate people.

Not a lot of resturaunts want to take this on, but retirement homes, libraries and classrooms are all good locations to get engagement.

 

[psidriven]

I again suggest an ultrasonic flow meter for barcode.

 

[H2OPlayar]

I again suggest an ultrasonic flow meter for barcode.

Not saying I am against it, but what is that, what does it measure, what actionable information can we get from it for our tanks, and how much is it? (Mostly just curious)