Considering a kalkwasser reactor

[yngplo]

Hey all, I was looking into getting a kalk reactor for the benefits of higher pH and phosphate control. I was confused when seeing how they set up kalk reactors with ATO pumps as well as dosing pumps.
If your ato pump is in the freshwater reservoir and it pushes kalk solution through the reactor, would you have your dosing pump also connected to the freshwater reservoir, but pump freshwater directly to the sump to keep salinity stable?

Or should you connect your ATO pump only to your sump to keep salinity stable, and then a dosing pump should go from your freshwater reservoir to the reactor to push consistent amounts of kalk through?

Does this make sense? Lol

 

[Da_Neefer]

You're on the right track. I use a BRS 50ml/min pump on a timer to pump ATO water into the Kalk Stirrer and then the saturated Kalk feeds into my sump via gravity. The timer runs the pump for 1-3 minutes per dosing event that's programmed. It's something like 1700ml a day right now. I also have an ATO feeding top off water into my sump based upon the sensor. The ATO runs less often the more Kalk is being doesd. If you're dosing more Kalk than your evaporation rate your ATO won't be turing on and your sump water level will rise past the sensor setting of the ATO. Thus reducing salinity. You're limited in how much Kalk you can add to your tank based upon your evaporation rate. This changes with humidity and the seasons.

BRS Top Off Doser - 50 mL per minute

Ideal for auto top off applications. Our peristaltic pump has a slow, predictable 50 mL per minute flow rate which ensures gradual and subtle changes to water chemistry. Precision two roller design extends pump life and will not back siphon. 24-month warranty offered by Bulk Reef Supply...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

The timer I'm using is built into the software of the KASA 6 outlet power strip and can do something like 18 on/off events per day. You could do the same with a controller like Neptune or GHL or even some of the other digital timer plugs out there.

 

[yngplo]

You're on the right track. I use a BRS 50ml/min pump on a timer to pump ATO water into the Kalk Stirrer and then the saturated Kalk feeds into my sump via gravity. The timer runs the pump for 1-3 minutes per dosing event that's programmed. It's something like 1700ml a day right now. I also have an ATO feeding top off water into my sump based upon the sensor. The ATO runs less often the more Kalk is being doesd. If you're dosing more Kalk than your evaporation rate your ATO won't be turing on and your sump water level will rise past the sensor setting of the ATO. Thus reducing salinity. You're limited in how much Kalk you can add to your tank based upon your evaporation rate. This changes with humidity and the seasons.

BRS Top Off Doser - 50 mL per minute

Ideal for auto top off applications. Our peristaltic pump has a slow, predictable 50 mL per minute flow rate which ensures gradual and subtle changes to water chemistry. Precision two roller design extends pump life and will not back siphon. 24-month warranty offered by Bulk Reef Supply...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

The timer I'm using is built into the software of the KASA 6 outlet power strip and can do something like 18 on/off events per day. You could do the same with a controller like Neptune or GHL or even some of the other digital timer plugs out there.

Thanks! I was thinking about picking up a kasa smart plug for this very purpose.

What's a good method to determine how much kalk you can dose before you hit that maximum evaporation amount? I'm assuming it changes regularly depending on the evaporation of the tank?

 

[Da_Neefer]

Thanks! I was thinking about picking up a kasa smart plug for this very purpose.

What's a good method to determine how much kalk you can dose before you hit that maximum evaporation amount? I'm assuming it changes regularly depending on the evaporation of the tank?

I base what I dose just with a general idea of how fast my 5g ATO empties out. You could convert your ATO volume to milliliters and divide by the time it takes to empty to be more accurate. 5 gallons of ATO water lasts me 4-5 days so 5g at 5 days gives me up to 3700mls of saturated Kalk to dose daily.

.

 

[Turkeysammich]

I’ve used one for years. It’s my main dos system. Except always make sure the Kalk is in a cloud. Almost like slurry. I extended the inlet tube so it’s in the mix. Works great for me. Then I make up the minor difference with 2 part.
You can dos slurry if your a advanced reefer like telegram. And have your controller correct the ph and alk dos. But I think it’s a little risky.

 

[Da_Neefer]

I’ve used one for years. It’s my main dos system. Except always make sure the Kalk is in a cloud. Almost like slurry. I extended the inlet tube so it’s in the mix. Works great for me. Then I make up the minor difference with 2 part.
You can dos slurry if your a advanced reefer like telegram. And have your controller correct the ph and alk dos. But I think it’s a little risky.

In my experience with the Avast Marine kalk stirrer I have, the saturated kalk being dosed is clear. Not cloudy. If it’s cloudy you’re dosing a slurry that’s much more powerful than just saturated and is an unknown concentration. Not something I’d recommend to anyone that doesn’t understand the pitfalls and consequences or is unable to monitor ph and alkalinity.

 

[Turkeysammich]

In my experience with the Avast Marine kalk stirrer I have, the saturated kalk being dosed is clear. Not cloudy. If it’s cloudy you’re dosing a slurry that’s much more powerful than just saturated and is an unknown concentration. Not something I’d recommend to anyone that doesn’t understand the pitfalls and consequences or is unable to monitor ph and alkalinity.

It’s only cloudy on the very bottom. I have the same reactor but mine is super old

 

[grizfyrfyter]

You can also skip the stirrer without losing out of kalk. Mix up a concentrated batch of lime water (kalkwasser + water). It's stable so it's a known value and doesn't degrade quickly. Put it on a dosing pump.

 

[sfsuphysics]

If it’s cloudy you’re dosing a slurry that’s much more powerful than just saturated and is an unknown concentration.

That may not necessarily be the case, when using a kalk "reactor" we are creating a completely saturated solution which is clear. any cloudy water that there is undissolved powder floating in the fluid this doesn't make the fluid any "more powerful" it's just there are undissolved bits in it. The bigger issue is this undissolved stuff could potentially land on corals and that's where you can get irritation and/or burning. With a reactor you put it more kalk powder than the liquid can hold, then when you dose it is replaced by freshwater continuing to create a saturated solution, some reactors (stirrers) use slow moving stirring rods which usually had a cloudy area at the bottom but clear at the top where it doses from or if they use a pump you need to mix well before you dose otherwise you don't allow the powder to settle back.

Now if you're not dosing via replenishment of fresh water, then yeah you create a solution that is to whatever strength you like, but if you go with a weaker solution you really shouldn't have any cloudy water as all the powder should easily dissolve into the water unless you get precipitation which is other issues in itself (also explains the crust on the top of kalkwasser)

 

[Qwiv]

Hey all, I was looking into getting a kalk reactor for the benefits of higher pH and phosphate control. I was confused when seeing how they set up kalk reactors with ATO pumps as well as dosing pumps.
If your ato pump is in the freshwater reservoir and it pushes kalk solution through the reactor, would you have your dosing pump also connected to the freshwater reservoir, but pump freshwater directly to the sump to keep salinity stable?

Or should you connect your ATO pump only to your sump to keep salinity stable, and then a dosing pump should go from your freshwater reservoir to the reactor to push consistent amounts of kalk through?

Does this make sense? Lol

You should look into if you really need a reactor. They make a lot of sense when you have a large tank with a large ATO container or one that refills automatically because you can feed water from the ATO container into the reactor with a dosing pump to feed tank in a controlled manner. It is basically saving you the space of the water volume in a separate Kalk container. With a 40 gallon tank, I am assuming you refill the ATO manually and the space of the Kalk reactor would be about the same as a container just full of Kalk, so just fill a dosing container manually when filling the ATO and give it a stir, add Kalk as needed. Saves complexity and a possible failure point.

I would not add a reactor unless you have all the controls on your tank like an Apex, etc. filling your ATO vessel or the space you have left for the reactor is significantly smaller then just a manual dosing container. With a 40 gallon tank, I can't imagine the volume of Kalk needed is less than the reactor.

 

[Da_Neefer]

That may not necessarily be the case, when using a kalk "reactor" we are creating a completely saturated solution which is clear. any cloudy water that there is undissolved powder floating in the fluid this doesn't make the fluid any "more powerful" it's just there are undissolved bits in it. The bigger issue is this undissolved stuff could potentially land on corals and that's where you can get irritation and/or burning. With a reactor you put it more kalk powder than the liquid can hold, then when you dose it is replaced by freshwater continuing to create a saturated solution, some reactors (stirrers) use slow moving stirring rods which usually had a cloudy area at the bottom but clear at the top where it doses from or if they use a pump you need to mix well before you dose otherwise you don't allow the powder to settle back.

Now if you're not dosing via replenishment of fresh water, then yeah you create a solution that is to whatever strength you like, but if you go with a weaker solution you really shouldn't have any cloudy water as all the powder should easily dissolve into the water unless you get precipitation which is other issues in itself (also explains the crust on the top of kalkwasser)

While the kalk is isolated in the stirrer/reactor etc the undissolved particles will stay undissolved as it's a saturated solution. If you are pushing undissolved Kalk into the tank or sump it will dissolve. When it dissolves it will provide a greater effect than the clear, fully saturated dose does. You can spike your PH. If you are dripping it into a an area with too little flow it will cause calcium carbonate precipitation due to the localized high ph.

Saturated Kalk dosing is just that. A clear, saturated, and fully dissolved solution. If your kalk is suspended in solution you should wait for it to become clear prior to dosing it.

If you are dosing a kalk slurry you should only be doing it intentionally at measured and calculated rates with PH and Alkalinity monitoring enabled. Fully aware of the risks and consequences involved or you are playing with fire.

The reason why I'm kind of pushing this point is that Calcium hydoxide is not a nice chemical. It's particularly nasty in a lot of different ways. You can nuke your corals by overdosing it with an unmeasured & undissolved solution/slurry.

 

[H2OPlayar]

Rich Ross talks a bunch about kalk, and about how he has nuked his tank 3x using it.

 

[rygh]

I used the Avast Marine works kalk stirrer with a peristaltic pump on Apex.
It stirs constantly. You push in RODI, and a bit of water dribbles out.
It generally worked fairly reliably. If you want a reactor, I would recommend it.
Kalk definitely brought up Alk levels.
There was a slight boost in PH. (Less for me because of other PH mitigation)

There is really no way for it to dump slurry in your tank. The exit to your tank is at the very top of the cylinder.
Although I guess if peristaltic pump is stuck on it would be a problem. But that is true of any doser.
Your tank might overflow also.

Two minor problems:
1) The slurry at the bottom was confusing.
When freshly started, it works great. You can see a bit of slurry, so you know when to add more powder.
But I think there is a certain amount of precipitate, perhaps due to impurities. Whatever.
So after a while, it looked like you had nice slurry, but it was really doing nothing.
So you really need to clean it completely occasionally. Not a big deal.

2) Pure Kalk did not have other elements.
I seem to have better luck with things like B-Ionic two part and such.
Of course, I could have done separate additives to compensate.

 

[Da_Neefer]

I used the Avast Marine works kalk stirrer with a peristaltic pump on Apex.
It stirs constantly. You push in RODI, and a bit of water dribbles out.
It generally worked fairly reliably. If you want a reactor, I would recommend it.
Kalk definitely brought up Alk levels.
There was a slight boost in PH. (Less for me because of other PH mitigation)

There is really no way for it to dump slurry in your tank. The exit to your tank is at the very top of the cylinder.
Although I guess if peristaltic pump is stuck on it would be a problem. But that is true of any doser.
Your tank might overflow also.

Two minor problems:
1) The slurry at the bottom was confusing.
When freshly started, it works great. You can see a bit of slurry, so you know when to add more powder.
But I think there is a certain amount of precipitate, perhaps due to impurities. Whatever.
So after a while, it looked like you had nice slurry, but it was really doing nothing.
So you really need to clean it completely occasionally. Not a big deal.

2) Pure Kalk did not have other elements.
I seem to have better luck with things like B-Ionic two part and such.
Of course, I could have done separate additives to compensate.

I like it and both the issues you brought up are spot on. I use it to raise ph a bit while the calcium reactor with ReMag does the heavy Alk, Ca, Mg lifting.