Jestersix

Cycling tank... good salt or not?

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sfsuphysics

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And by good salt I just mean "the kind I am going to use" and by "not good" salt I mean something cheap like instant ocean.

And we're talking about with rock without any crap on it that'll die off and decay, so the need for an immediate water change afterwards is not necessary.
 
I would just use whatever salt you will be using later since you aren’t planning on massive water changes before adding livestock.

That said, there isn’t much cost difference between what I use and “not good” salt because I use IO Reef Crystals.
 
oh I agree, Instant Ocean is the cheapest, and everything else is very similar in cost. It's just the stuff I ordered is a week and a half out from getting here. THE local store in San Francisco, well the one I'm willing to go to, is IO or IO-RC only if memory serves, it has been a while since I've been.
 
Nothing wrong with plain old IO. I have used it for many years.
A bit high in Alk, a bit low in CA. Easily tweaked.
Available everywhere.

Step it up a bit and use red sea blue bucket if you want.

I am just not a fan of premium salts. Especially when they add amino acids and such.
 
Probably 8 out of ten of the most successful reefers use IO or RC. :) It took me a long time to figure that out and there's very good reasons for it. IO is inexpensive, but it's "stable." It always mixes the same and you can store and keep it for weeks. That's not true with most of the designer salts (and I have the coral losses to prove it. :)) I studied it for months, tried different salts for a long time and quizzed store owners who wouldn't carry IO, etc and finally came to a few conclusions. One, designer salts are recommended by many retailers because it has a good profit margin. IO and RC don't and they go on sale as low as $25.00 a box. Two, designer salts are usually not stable after 24-48 hours and have to be used immediately. Three, designer salts have production issues (ie they don't always mix the same.)

Once I kind of figured that out I reached out to a couple dozen highly successful reefers.Almost all used IO.
 
I know of just as many successful reefers running ‘designer’ salt.

The main thing is that you have to use it within their guidelines. RSCP must be mixed in cold water and used within 4 hours. I think Fritz says 2 hours. Every manufacturer has their guidelines for use. Follow it and you will be fine.


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Vhuang168 said:
I know of just as many successful reefers running ‘designer’ salt.

The main thing is that you have to use it within their guidelines. RSCP must be mixed in cold water and used within 4 hours. I think Fritz says 2 hours. Every manufacturer has their guidelines for use. Follow it and you will be fine.


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Click to expand...

That's what always amuses me about stores that sell pre-mixed Fritz, etc at a premium. It's a recipe for disaster.
 
Well the "designer" salt that I ordered was the Red Sea stuff in the blue bucket, just to give it a roll. I know I've had plenty of luck with Reef Crystals in the past as well as Aquavitro Salinity but I wanted to get away from the later due to the limited availability of it (only available at LFS) and just wanted to try something that was as close to sea water as possible due to storage issues (no Fritz) as I plan on having a 100G container mixed with salt ready at all time.

Saw one of the later BRS vids were they broke down the actual cost of salts when mixed to 35ppt, and it turns out most all of them are 49-50c per gallon, ironically Reef Crystals is at the 50c/gal mark while Red Sea and others are at 49, except for one particular Tropic Marine salt that's at 54c/gal, and of course IO which is at 39c/gal. So ultimately the price between them really isn't that different when actually mixed. They did mention also doing a storage test, but that video isn't out yet, so we'll have to see which ones suck (they don't sell Fritz, so that one probably won't be in that test)
 
sfsuphysics said:
Well the "designer" salt that I ordered was the Red Sea stuff in the blue bucket, just to give it a roll. I know I've had plenty of luck with Reef Crystals in the past as well as Aquavitro Salinity but I wanted to get away from the later due to the limited availability of it (only available at LFS) and just wanted to try something that was as close to sea water as possible due to storage issues (no Fritz) as I plan on having a 100G container mixed with salt ready at all time.

Saw one of the later BRS vids were they broke down the actual cost of salts when mixed to 35ppt, and it turns out most all of them are 49-50c per gallon, ironically Reef Crystals is at the 50c/gal mark while Red Sea and others are at 49, except for one particular Tropic Marine salt that's at 54c/gal, and of course IO which is at 39c/gal. So ultimately the price between them really isn't that different when actually mixed. They did mention also doing a storage test, but that video isn't out yet, so we'll have to see which ones suck (they don't sell Fritz, so that one probably won't be in that test)
Click to expand...
I don’t think of Red Sea blue bucket as a designer or high end salt. I think of it as an excellent stable baseline salt, very much like Reef Crystals.

Their black bucket (Coral Pro) is the one that gets into the designer/unstable category with artificially elevated Alk etc.

I don’t see why anyone would buy salt with organics and other non-salt additives in it. I just don’t see the advantage, whereas the disadvantages are obvious. If someone can explain it in non-hyped terms I would be interested to learn.
 
I’ve always wondered if these mixes aren’t stable to sit in a reservoir, what makes them stable once they’re in the tank? So if fritz loses 2dkh after sitting in my mixing barrel for 2 days, what keeps it from doing the same thing when it goes into the dt?
 
Flagg37 said:
I’ve always wondered if these mixes aren’t stable to sit in a reservoir, what makes them stable once they’re in the tank? So if fritz loses 2dkh after sitting in my mixing barrel for 2 days, what keeps it from doing the same thing when it goes into the dt?
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I think it has to do with how it interacts with the water you are mixing it with and aeration/ph to a large extent.
 
sfsuphysics said:
Well the "designer" salt that I ordered was the Red Sea stuff in the blue bucket, just to give it a roll. I know I've had plenty of luck with Reef Crystals in the past as well as Aquavitro Salinity but I wanted to get away from the later due to the limited availability of it (only available at LFS) and just wanted to try something that was as close to sea water as possible due to storage issues (no Fritz) as I plan on having a 100G container mixed with salt ready at all time.

Saw one of the later BRS vids were they broke down the actual cost of salts when mixed to 35ppt, and it turns out most all of them are 49-50c per gallon, ironically Reef Crystals is at the 50c/gal mark while Red Sea and others are at 49, except for one particular Tropic Marine salt that's at 54c/gal, and of course IO which is at 39c/gal. So ultimately the price between them really isn't that different when actually mixed. They did mention also doing a storage test, but that video isn't out yet, so we'll have to see which ones suck (they don't sell Fritz, so that one probably won't be in that test)
Click to expand...

Not trying to persuade you one way or the other but I reckon if you factor in IO going on sale often the price is probably lower than what BRS says. Not a huge deal either way I’m sure!
 
Key: If you dose, and do not do tons of giant water changes, the Alk/Ca levels in your salt are
not really that important. Your tank levels are really based mostly on dosing levels.
The only concern is Mg, which most people do not dose. That can drop.
And Mg is a bit of an issue with standard IO.

IO-standard is substantially cheaper. It is on sale a lot, so you can commonly get 200G mix for $45.
That is about HALF of most other salts, and more like $0.25/G.

I do like red sea blue bucket because it is so close to normal sea water.
I guess of all salts, that is my favorite. Quality + good levels of everything + competitive cost.
The real problem is getting it in the right sizes, which is why I generally don't use it.

IO-RC did have a lot of complaints something like 5 years ago about parameters being way off on certain batches.
Seems fine now though.
The downside is the added "vitamins" and "metal detoxifiers." Organics and chemicals I don't need.

IO + IO-RC is way better for shipping due to the 200g box with 4 sealed 50g bags.
I have no idea why other manufacturers do not do that.

A side frustration is how the "50 gallons" mix never makes 50 gallons at 35ppt.
 
pbh-reef said:
Not trying to persuade you one way or the other but I reckon if you factor in IO going on sale often the price is probably lower than what BRS says. Not a huge deal either way I’m sure!
Click to expand...
They also tested a bucket. You get significantly more value from a box.

I use IO sea salt and dose to compensate but after a few ICP tests I'm having trouble with some trace elements.

Considering switching to the Brightwell Aquatics salt but availability locally is a concern. I keep a pair of 55g drums full of RODI water at all time in case of emergency (mine or someone local).

IO is also very convenient that I can do a ~50g water change, refill the drum and dump a bag of salt in and it's just about the right salinity. I only have to make minor adjustments.
 
rygh said:
Key: If you dose, and do not do tons of giant water changes, the Alk/Ca levels in your salt are
not really that important. Your tank levels are really based mostly on dosing levels.
The only concern is Mg, which most people do not dose. That can drop.
And Mg is a bit of an issue with standard IO.

IO-standard is substantially cheaper. It is on sale a lot, so you can commonly get 200G mix for $45.
That is about HALF of most other salts, and more like $0.25/G.

I do like red sea blue bucket because it is so close to normal sea water.
I guess of all salts, that is my favorite. Quality + good levels of everything + competitive cost.
The real problem is getting it in the right sizes, which is why I generally don't use it.

IO-RC did have a lot of complaints something like 5 years ago about parameters being way off on certain batches.
Seems fine now though.
The downside is the added "vitamins" and "metal detoxifiers." Organics and chemicals I don't need.

IO + IO-RC is way better for shipping due to the 200g box with 4 sealed 50g bags.
I have no idea why other manufacturers do not do that.

A side frustration is how the "50 gallons" mix never makes 50 gallons at 35ppt.
Click to expand...
Put your float valve lower in your mixing barrel
So that it’s more concentrated.
 
sfsuphysics said:
And by good salt I just mean "the kind I am going to use" and by "not good" salt I mean something cheap like instant ocean.

And we're talking about with rock without any crap on it that'll die off and decay, so the need for an immediate water change afterwards is not necessary.
Click to expand...

Got a box of IO for you; from the AC New Year's sale.
 
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