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Kinetic ELOS 120XL

Status update:

ELOS
  • Still no Quiet Drain 3 instructions. I've asked nicely once a week with zero response.
  • Still waiting on the stand to ship with the right screws
  • I sent the overflow lids back, including the one that fits but needs to be replaced since it came fairly damaged. Still no response for this either.
Luna-Reef
  • Put in the deposit for the custom sump, ATO, and stand tray, so waiting on their CAD designs. It's been about 2 weeks, but I'm guessing they're just backed up
  • I'm considering having them make my dosing reservoirs to match, but that seems a bit much
Equipment
  • Still waiting for any black friday deals, but nothing that I need is on sale yet
  • Plumbing I just need to measure the true distances of the overflow plumbing to see if I could actually fit things like unions right at the threads at the bottom, or if I'll need to thread in some elbows to get the right space. After I measure, I can go HAM on buying a ton of pvc fittings and start dry fitting everything
  • BRS sent me a new controller for the Gyres because of that weird connection thing, so now I have a backup controller (with a weird connection thing). Always nice to have a backup in case something goes wrong with mine, or to be a helping loaner to another club member!
  • Plumbing is scary, but everyone gave me a lot of good advice and I might just simplify and use a dedicated UV pump. This removes all the needs for flow meters (since I'll just use a timer and a cup to measure the flow) and all sorts of valves. I have so many nice VarioS pumps that aren't being used, so might as well repurpose that.
  • Return pump: still planning on the Royal Exclusiv RD3 100watt HP. I'm going to just bite the bullet and buy two, one as a backup. It's a crap ton of money, but it'll be worth it. While I fix one, I can still have the other pump keeping things alive. Crossing my fingers for a sale though...
Rock
  • Jetersix got his rock shipment in finally and is constructing my aquascape! Hoping for some results in the next week or so. I'm excited with what he comes up with
 
Looking pretty far into the future, but after the new tank cycles, I'm going to move my inverts (including bta's and magnifica) from the temp tank to the new display, but then keep it fallow for 76 days (just to be safe there). Then run my remaining two fish (clowns) through an ich QT of some sort (copper, maybe TTM), then I'll just source all my fish from quarantined shops like Hightide.

Plan:
  1. Cycle the new tank
  2. Add live reef rubble (aquabiomics)
  3. Move anemones, cerith, and trochus snails over
  4. I'll also get a tiger tail cucumber and probably a few more trochus (captive bred)
  5. Fallow for 76 days after adding these guys
  6. Then start adding QT'd fish and corals
 
Black Friday deals started up, and I've pretty much emptied all my tank savings for everything. The only thing I have left is the AquaDriver skimmer neck cleaner. I don't know if they'll have any black friday deals, so no rush to get that.

What I just purchased:
  • ReefMat 1200 + Extra roll
  • Neptune DOS (now I have 2)
  • Neptune Apex A3 Pro
  • IceCap Turf Scrubber Pro - Medium
  • Royal Exclusiv RD3 100watt High Pressure (return pump)
  • Simplicity dosing reservoir + float switches
  • 1" and 3/4" black PVC
  • Handfuls of 90 and 45 elbows, unions, and adapters
  • 1" Spears Gate Valve
  • More citric acid (can never get enough of that)
  • Reef dips (CoralRX, seachem)
 
Well, it's been another month and a half without any responses from ELOS. They promised the new stand and hardware this month, yet I've gotten nothing despite requesting updates every few months. They have had 3 months to tell me if this wasn't going to happen, yet I've gotten nothing.

I've been overly patient and understanding. The company clearly doesn't care. Who would be proud of this kind of effort?

I'm at the point where I'm giving ELOS a strong negative recommendation across the board. They are completely crap. Maybe their tanks have good glass, but what good is that when nothing else you paid for actually works/looks right.

I'm considering what to do next:
  1. Continue asking for replacements, information, screws, an overflow lid that fits, etc.
  2. Return the tank for a refund and eat the cost of shipping it back
  3. Return the tank for a refund, but demand them pay for shipping and packing back up
  4. Go through my credit card company to fight the transaction completely (or maybe just for the portion of the stand). I feel like this would take a long time and might be unsuccessful.
  5. Maybe they see more value in just giving me a refund and not dealing with me anymore, not even shipping it back? It seems like they don't care about the business anyway.
  6. Talk to a lawyer and maybe take it to court
I don't know how to even contact them. They won't respond to emails, take phone calls or anything. I've contacted the ELOS headquarters, but they won't respond either. Are there any other options I can take?
 
kinetic said:
Well, it's been another month and a half without any responses from ELOS. They promised the new stand and hardware this month, yet I've gotten nothing despite requesting updates every few months. They have had 3 months to tell me if this wasn't going to happen, yet I've gotten nothing.

I've been overly patient and understanding. The company clearly doesn't care. Who would be proud of this kind of effort?

I'm at the point where I'm giving ELOS a strong negative recommendation across the board. They are completely crap. Maybe their tanks have good glass, but what good is that when nothing else you paid for actually works/looks right.

I'm considering what to do next:
  1. Continue asking for replacements, information, screws, an overflow lid that fits, etc.
  2. Return the tank for a refund and eat the cost of shipping it back
  3. Return the tank for a refund, but demand them pay for shipping and packing back up
  4. Go through my credit card company to fight the transaction completely (or maybe just for the portion of the stand). I feel like this would take a long time and might be unsuccessful.
  5. Maybe they see more value in just giving me a refund and not dealing with me anymore, not even shipping it back? It seems like they don't care about the business anyway.
  6. Talk to a lawyer and maybe take it to court
I don't know how to even contact them. They won't respond to emails, take phone calls or anything. I've contacted the ELOS headquarters, but they won't respond either. Are there any other options I can take?
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I’m sorry to hear about this frustrating process! I would personally either charge it back via CC or do small claims. I wish you luck in this process.
 
I would file a charge back for the full amount (I don't believe they can do a partial charge back for just the stand. You have plenty of evidence that they didnt deliver the product you thought you were buying and they have stopped contact with you.
 
I guess I should probably start considering a different tank if I end up returning it. If he does give me a full refund, I may just use the money to fix up the stand and do everything to get it in shape. Otherwise I'll probably look into getting something like the CADE peninsula or if Waterbox's Infinia peninsula would come in a non-industrial looking stand, that would be a good option too.
 
kinetic said:
I guess I should probably start considering a different tank if I end up returning it. If he does give me a full refund, I may just use the money to fix up the stand and do everything to get it in shape. Otherwise I'll probably look into getting something like the CADE peninsula or if Waterbox's Infinia peninsula would come in a non-industrial looking stand, that would be a good option too.
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Those cade tanks have really been getting my attention lately. The multi side opening stand for a peninsula tank is just my idea of perfect. Sorry you've been going through all this nonsense. At this point would it be faster to fab a custom stand that's higher quality? Or just eat the cost and hire someone to repair what's not up to spec while having the credit card company deal with refunds.

I'd prob start conditioning the new rock while you can too just to get the good critters growing.
 
Darkxerox said:
Those cade tanks have really been getting my attention lately. The multi side opening stand for a peninsula tank is just my idea of perfect. Sorry you've been going through all this nonsense. At this point would it be faster to fab a custom stand that's higher quality? Or just eat the cost and hire someone to repair what's not up to spec while having the credit card company deal with refunds.

I'd prob start conditioning the new rock while you can too just to get the good critters growing.
Click to expand...

Yeah CADE does look really good. It has some similarities with what I wanted with the ELOS. I think that CADE is a lot more opinionated in how you should set things up, so as long as you set it up as designed, it works really well, but if you deviate from that (which is very likely), a lot of custom work/modification needs to be done. It's not a big deal, but with ELOS it's more of a blank slate (big space that you can do whatever you want with in the stand). I'm not sure which is better, but the ELOS does have an extra couple of inches in width, and at the time of purchase CADE didn't have white cabinets.

I've heard CADE or at least the distributors are really supportive. That should be a given, but I guess it's one thing that's probably going to make it way better.
 
It's been another 2 months, and I finally gotten through to Francois at ELOS America.

All the promises were lies. I will not be getting any resolution. He says he's broke, has no more money, and ELOS won't send him replacements, stands, etc. He has $25,000 tanks that people purchased that ELOS still won't ship him even after 12 months. ELOS won't give him any money for it. He said ELOS tanks will never be sold in the U.S. again, not in the next 10 years. He's selling what he has left, and that's it.

I'm just fking out of luck, and that's it. I spent a crap ton of money on this stupid thing, and I won't get any support, warranty, etc. out of it at all.

I asked for a refund, but he doesn't even have that. I'd have to ship it all back, then he'd have to sell it, to get me my money. LOL.

Do I want to fight this for months and months and maybe get money back? No. I'm just the sucker who trusted the wrong people. I hate this. This is a fun hobby. It's supposed to be delightful, rewarding, and of course it has its challenges, but that's the fun of it... but not like this. This is bull.

So here you all go. I took one for the team. Don't even think about ELOS.
 
kinetic said:
It's been another 2 months, and I finally gotten through to Francois at ELOS America.

All the promises were lies. I will not be getting any resolution. He says he's broke, has no more money, and ELOS won't send him replacements, stands, etc. He has $25,000 tanks that people purchased that ELOS still won't ship him even after 12 months. ELOS won't give him any money for it. He said ELOS tanks will never be sold in the U.S. again, not in the next 10 years. He's selling what he has left, and that's it.

I'm just fking out of luck, and that's it. I spent a crap ton of money on this stupid thing, and I won't get any support, warranty, etc. out of it at all.

I asked for a refund, but he doesn't even have that. I'd have to ship it all back, then he'd have to sell it, to get me my money. LOL.

Do I want to fight this for months and months and maybe get money back? No. I'm just the sucker who trusted the wrong people. I hate this. This is a fun hobby. It's supposed to be delightful, rewarding, and of course it has its challenges, but that's the fun of it... but not like this. This is bull.

So here you all go. I took one for the team. Don't even think about ELOS.
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So sorry to hear this.
 
kinetic said:
It's been another 2 months, and I finally gotten through to Francois at ELOS America.

All the promises were lies. I will not be getting any resolution. He says he's broke, has no more money, and ELOS won't send him replacements, stands, etc. He has $25,000 tanks that people purchased that ELOS still won't ship him even after 12 months. ELOS won't give him any money for it. He said ELOS tanks will never be sold in the U.S. again, not in the next 10 years. He's selling what he has left, and that's it.

I'm just fking out of luck, and that's it. I spent a crap ton of money on this stupid thing, and I won't get any support, warranty, etc. out of it at all.

I asked for a refund, but he doesn't even have that. I'd have to ship it all back, then he'd have to sell it, to get me my money. LOL.

Do I want to fight this for months and months and maybe get money back? No. I'm just the sucker who trusted the wrong people. I hate this. This is a fun hobby. It's supposed to be delightful, rewarding, and of course it has its challenges, but that's the fun of it... but not like this. This is bull.

So here you all go. I took one for the team. Don't even think about ELOS.
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I’m so sorry. Can you do small claims still? I would never recommend an Elos based on this thread.
(Opinions are my own)
 
That's a bummer. At least the whole picture makes sense now and you don't need to keep wondering what's going on.

At this point you've got what seems to be a solid setup with a couple cosmetic issues. If you step back and look at what you have, and try to ignore your previous vision of what you thought you'd have, are you happy with it? If so, it seems like it's probably highest ROI to move forward with what you've got and cut off future convos and trying to get anything from him/them. It's going to keep replacing happiness opportunities with frustrations.

If you're really not happy, then the credit card option is probably your best bet. Contact them. Lay out the situation, and ask for guidance on if they can handle it as some sort of extended warranty situation or charge back. Letting them handle it and tell you your options is a much easier path to whatever resolution you can get. Things where you need to further invest time in this is likely going to be a major downer. At the extreme, having to go into a small claims court with some guy across the county feels like weeks of frustration, lost vacation time, and there being no chance you get all your money back.

Mega downer in the past and current, but I'd be careful not to let it be a mega downer into the future.
 
Very unfortunate to hear of your outcome. You should definitely post this on the FB group, Saltwater Scammers. That group has a pretty big following at 8200 followers. Maybe this will push Francois to rethink and provide a better solution. Maybe try to resell your tank to recoup enough money to buy a custom tank or Innovative Marine EXT200. Innovative Marine has killer 40% off deals on their Made to Order tanks. The tanks and APS are really good quality too.
 
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