Need Some Drain & Sump Wisdom

[ReyDeFarts]

Lol most all these ideas are being repeated from the original thread of this tank plus a few more !

Oh... I'll have to go look for that. Appreciate the insight on that.

But then you have to come over the top or drill for the returns. Me personally, I hate the look of over the top return lines. Also, I like not having a fat internal overflow box taking up tank real estate.

I'm not too concerned about the drilling. I'm fairly confident I could handle that. I think I'm going to go that route anyway now. Dual pumps and returns.

I do agree with you about the bulky overflow boxes. Not ideal. Saving a couple hundred $ though for other equipment... that will likely be the deciding factor. If @a.little.hypertonic wants it gone, then it will be getting ripped out and I'll be shopping for an external overflow box. LOL For a couple hundred bucks, I can deal with losing a little real estate. It could be utilized as a cool growing wall too.

You can also reduce the risk of that, by reducing the water volume in the return section. A trick I've used is put live rock in that return section. A pump isn't going to suck up a rock, so that effectively reduces the return water volume by displacing water out.

That's a great idea. How about those BioBricks?

I personally wouldn't go ball valve and I wouldn’t set up a bean animal on this size tank. But admittedly, if there’s one thing I’m OCD about, it’s plumbing.

Thanks for all your insight btw. As much planning on the plumbing is the plan. So your wisdom is much appreciated!

So why not the bean animal drain? If I'm going to end up drilling 3/4" returns on each side, I won't be using the holes.

Also, I understand your logic about if the main drain gets clogged, and the small drain cannot handle the flow, then I'd have a large issue. But I'm having a hard time envisioning a 1.5" drain line getting clogged. From what?! Forgive my ignorance. But I'd rather have a larger drain from the start.

I had a thought about testing what you're saying though. What if I filled the tank and set it up to drain out of a small hole, and have the other ones ready in case it can't handle it. Confirm if it can or cannot handle the full flow in an emergency. If it is able to handle the flow, then using the larger pipe as the main drain would be better right? Then just setup the other two as a secondary and emergency?

The emergency would require both the primary and secondary getting clogged. And again I ask, from what? I'm sorry if that seems like a silly question. I'm just not sure what could cause that kind of blockage.

Can always have return pump connected to float switches/ magnetic sensors one in sump other in display that turns return pump off for low water in sump and high flood levels in display.. just keep it a simple low maintenance tank

I'm assuming an Apex or Hydros is needed for something like that? Cause that doesn't sound simple! LOL

 

[ReyDeFarts]

Lol most all these ideas are being repeated from the original thread of this tank plus a few more !

I'm not finding it. Care to share a link please?

 

[MarcosDelgado0]

Lol most all these ideas are being repeated from the original thread of this tank plus a few more !

I'm not finding it. Care to share a link please?

I think he means the PIF thread? I don’t think we really went into depth about plumbing as we did here though

Free cadlight 70g with stand

I was using this as a qt tank therefore didnt use the overflow. Found out thanks to @PjFish the plumbings is in metric. Its missing a bulkhead and an emergency pipe in metric. The 1/2" is too big. You can drill the holes to make them 1/2" Pick up in 95121 for supporting members Tank...

www.bareefers.org

 

[ReyDeFarts]

I think he means the PIF thread? I don’t think we really went into depth about plumbing as we did here though

Free cadlight 70g with stand

I was using this as a qt tank therefore didnt use the overflow. Found out thanks to @PjFish the plumbings is in metric. Its missing a bulkhead and an emergency pipe in metric. The 1/2" is too big. You can drill the holes to make them 1/2" Pick up in 95121 for supporting members Tank...

www.bareefers.org

Thanks. I have this one bookmarked already. I was thinking maybe it was a journal or something. I even tried looking under popper.

 

[MarcosDelgado0]

Thanks. I have this one bookmarked already. I was thinking maybe it was a journal or something. I even tried looking under popper.

Yeah I tried looking too but I couldn’t find any other thread so I think that’s what he’s referring to

 

[PjFish]

Sorry life got busy!! Yeah that was the thread I was referring to as I said plus more great ideas from members on this one!
..Durso, Herbie or Beananimal all have been proven and used a long while..Each one of these drains handle different rates of flow as most of us are aware assuming plumbing diameter is all the same. When you use different sized drains on the same build its a wildcard. Sure you can roughly do the gph math on each bulkhead size but physically testing is the best way to determine what size pump the plumbing can handle on a mixed drain plumbing. The main question is how much flow do you want or need through the sump? When that’s determined then you can build the plumbing accordingly! Otherwise your just going in circles unless you oversize everything. Maybe some slip fittings/ barbs/flex hoses first to get water moving to get a better idea before glue
Hi low water controller/sensors have been out for a long time which Ive used for various home construction projects..The aquarium specific ones are just scaled down but same logic…Several return pumps have them already built in using a float switch like the Reef Octopus VarioS models but there are several more also with low water shut off.

AutoAqua's Smart Level Security is plug-and-play $59.. All you do is just plug your return pump into it then set the magnet sensor in the display at your maximum water level height..This will kill power to pump when water reaches the sensor. You can buy two level sensors and plug them back to back and use the other for low water in the return section if needed or use both hi/low in the sump.. They have a skimmer one also..
basically like an ATO with long cables on the sensors.
One thing I never do is put any gate valve/ ball valves on the drain pipes this eliminates any chance of blockages from debris/ fish/snails etc getting trapped in the valves drains are meant to be wide open and not controlled in my opinion but alot of people use them to throttle down flooding the torpedo tube to quiet them…
.I saw the tank at poppers loved the dimensions of it and looks reminds me of @Srt4eric tank ..just don’t have time for a project tank atm
its going to look great when completed!!

 

[RandyC]

Oh... I'll have to go look for that. Appreciate the insight on that.


I'm not too concerned about the drilling. I'm fairly confident I could handle that. I think I'm going to go that route anyway now. Dual pumps and returns.

I do agree with you about the bulky overflow boxes. Not ideal. Saving a couple hundred $ though for other equipment... that will likely be the deciding factor. If @a.little.hypertonic wants it gone, then it will be getting ripped out and I'll be shopping for an external overflow box. LOL For a couple hundred bucks, I can deal with losing a little real estate. It could be utilized as a cool growing wall too.

That's a great idea. How about those BioBricks?


Thanks for all your insight btw. As much planning on the plumbing is the plan. So your wisdom is much appreciated!

So why not the bean animal drain? If I'm going to end up drilling 3/4" returns on each side, I won't be using the holes.

Also, I understand your logic about if the main drain gets clogged, and the small drain cannot handle the flow, then I'd have a large issue. But I'm having a hard time envisioning a 1.5" drain line getting clogged. From what?! Forgive my ignorance. But I'd rather have a larger drain from the start.

I had a thought about testing what you're saying though. What if I filled the tank and set it up to drain out of a small hole, and have the other ones ready in case it can't handle it. Confirm if it can or cannot handle the full flow in an emergency. If it is able to handle the flow, then using the larger pipe as the main drain would be better right? Then just setup the other two as a secondary and emergency?

The emergency would require both the primary and secondary getting clogged. And again I ask, from what? I'm sorry if that seems like a silly question. I'm just not sure what could cause that kind of blockage.

I'm assuming an Apex or Hydros is needed for something like that? Cause that doesn't sound simple! LOL

Your main drain would have a valve on it. It’s not the whole 1.5” pipe that would have to be blocked, just the opening in the valve.

Nothing wrong with bean animal, I just feel in tanks this size, it causes you to lose precious real estate under in the sump area without much benefit. With a weir with good spacing and properly sized drains, the chances of having two drains plugged at the exact same time to need the third isn’t likely. For larger tanks, bean animal can be more important because of increased flow rates.

 

[PjFish]

Most LFS run a one drain modified durso on all their tanks that are plumed together. They appear temporary have sand/rocks/ livestock 10 to 50 gallon tanks etc but run for years and years longer then most people are in then out of the hobby. How often do the LFS have issues flooding with only one drain in those tanks? Always wondered about that maybe someone with experience can chime in?

 

[Coral reefer]

Most LFS run a one drain modified durso on all their tanks that are plumed together. They appear temporary have sand/rocks/ livestock 10 to 50 gallon tanks etc but run for years and years longer then most people are in then out of the hobby. How often do the LFS have issues flooding with only one drain in those tanks? Always wondered about that maybe someone with experience can chime in?

I don’t like this comparison for several reasons. Lfs almost never have snails which are a very likely culprit of clogging. Also they have people (often multiple different people) looking at those tanks many times a day every single day.

 

[PjFish]

I don’t like this comparison for several reasons. Lfs almost never have snails which are a very likely culprit of clogging. Also they have people (often multiple different people) looking at those tanks many times a day every single day.?

That was a blanket observation of all the LFS Ive been to over the years which is well over 1k was not only talking about a few local ones..
I buy all my snails from LFS some are in dedicated invert tanks with the exact same drains as fish only while others are spread out depending where they need them so would this imply greater risk of blockade in invert tanks?
The same plumbing applies to their freshwater systems which have single drains and normally fish/gravel/ plants/snails in most every tank .. Yes their are LFS that run sterile BB dedicated tanks only like wholesalers. But thats a small percentage of LFS compared to all the others that do furnished tanks to please customers .I kinda make it a habit on road trips across the country to hit up LFS especially when the wife not riding shotgun lol .. Im not promoting single drains on medium/ large builds but smaller tanks low flow are fine! All in one tanks can flood over also if the overflow slots get clogged which happened to me due to a medium piece of nori ripped off the clip then blocking the slots which is where those magnetic level sensors can help turn off the pimp..We are so spoiled in the bay area with all the quality of shops well not so much in the north bay!! Redding has some great saltwater shops prices are a steal compared to the bay..

 

[BAYMAC]

Most LFS run a one drain modified durso on all their tanks that are plumed together. They appear temporary have sand/rocks/ livestock 10 to 50 gallon tanks etc but run for years and years longer then most people are in then out of the hobby. How often do the LFS have issues flooding with only one drain in those tanks? Always wondered about that maybe someone with experience can chime in?

Well, we had a TON of overflows from filling, but only a few with drains... and those were snail tanks, like Coral Reefer mentioned.

 

[BAYMAC]

That was a blanket observation of all the LFS Ive been to over the years which is well over 1k was not only talking about a few local ones..
I buy all my snails from LFS some are in dedicated invert tanks with the exact same drains as fish only while others are spread out depending where they need them so would this imply greater risk of blockade in invert tanks?
The same plumbing applies to their freshwater systems which have single drains and normally fish/gravel/ plants/snails in most every tank .. Yes their are LFS that run sterile BB dedicated tanks only like wholesalers. But thats a small percentage of LFS compared to all the others that do furnished tanks to please customers .I kinda make it a habit on road trips across the country to hit up LFS especially when the wife not riding shotgun lol .. Im not promoting single drains on medium/ large builds but smaller tanks low flow are fine! All in one tanks can flood over also if the overflow slots get clogged which happened to me due to a medium piece of nori ripped off the clip then blocking the slots which is where those magnetic level sensors can help turn off the pimp..We are so spoiled in the bay area with all the quality of shops well not so much in the north bay!! Redding has some great saltwater shops prices are a steal compared to the bay..

Over a thousand LFS?

I can barely make that claim and I was flown around the US for nearly a decade to visit LFS.

What were you doing?

 

[PjFish]

Well, we had a TON of overflows from filling, but only a few with drains... and those were snail tanks, like Coral Reefer mentioned.

How do you overflow while filling. Walking away and forgetting?

 

[PjFish]

Over a thousand LFS?

I can barely make that claim and I was flown around the US for nearly a decade to visit LFS.

What were you doing?

Doing surveillances all over the country sitting in parked undercover vehicles for hours on end up to 24hrs at times..Hotter then hell itself!! Not glamorous like some people think lol..Homemade swamp coolers using computer fans ziplock bags and plenty of wide mouth gatorade bottles!! Battery backups/ inverters running camera gear..Down time would visit LFS plus larger cities would have alot of shops especially coastal !

 

[PjFish]

Over a thousand LFS?

I can barely make that claim and I was flown around the US for nearly a decade to visit LFS.

What were you doin

Over a thousand LFS?

I can barely make that claim and I was flown around the US for nearly a decade to visit LFS.

What were you doing?

I didn’t fly had to drive.. If you had to drive and visited lfs between all the large cities that were not on your list you would definitely hit 1k

 

[PjFish]

I didn’t fly had to drive.. If you had to drive and visited lfs between all the large cities that were not on your list you would definitely hit 1k

Plus back then it was strictly physical maps/ Thomas guides and phone books lol

 

[BAYMAC]

Doing surveillances all over the country sitting in parked undercover vehicles for hours on end up to 24hrs at times..Hotter then hell itself!! Not glamorous like some people think lol..Homemade swamp coolers using computer fans ziplock bags and plenty of wide mouth gatorade bottles!! Battery backups/ inverters running camera gear..Down time would visit LFS plus larger cities would have alot of shops especially coastal !

OMG not for me. I did a ton of driving, but you definitely did far more. And my parking lot time was minimal

Yeah, filling, customer interrupts, another comes along, phone rings..... oh crap, get the squeegee.

Flipside, we didn't have to sweep often lol

In the saltwater sections, we only had overflows from snails. Freshwater, plants and every so often, dead fish, especially the feeder fish.

 

[PjFish]

Over a thousand LFS?

I can barely make that claim and I was flown around the US for nearly a decade to visit LFS.

What were you doing?

Plus worked with Christie’s Auctions/ Lords of London delivering jewelry and paintings all over the U.S.. which gave me a little more free time on the road. Dirty a van up slap a proud parent bumper sticker of some random high school no one would think your driving 8 digits of cargo lol

 

[ReyDeFarts]

So we will be saving our money and not getting a new overflow box. Proceeding with keeping the internal overflow and modifying the existing drilled holes for the drains (and possibly use one for the return). @a.little.hypertonic seems reluctant about drilling new holes in the tank.

I currently have a pvc adapter on order to switch the larger pipe to a standard 1¼" pipe under the tank. I'm going to keep the "bulkhead" that came with the tank so I can utilize the existing plumbing inside the overflow.

I haven't had a chance to test the drainage capability of a single 1/2 outlet. That's still next on the list. If it is able to handle the full flow, then that may seal the deal and just go with the larger pipe as the main drain and a single emergency drain. Then use the other 1/2 for the return. If she says screw it, I want dual returns drilled in, then bean animal it is!

 

[MarcosDelgado0]

So we will be saving our money and not getting a new overflow box. Proceeding with keeping the internal overflow and modifying the existing drilled holes for the drains (and possibly use one for the return). @a.little.hypertonic seems reluctant about drilling new holes in the tank.

I currently have a pvc adapter on order to switch the larger pipe to a standard 1¼" pipe under the tank. I'm going to keep the "bulkhead" that came with the tank so I can utilize the existing plumbing inside the overflow.

I haven't had a chance to test the drainage capability of a single 1/2 outlet. That's still next on the list. If it is able to handle the full flow, then that may seal the deal and just go with the larger pipe as the main drain and a single emergency drain. Then use the other 1/2 for the return. If she says screw it, I want dual returns drilled in, then bean animal it is!