Thinking about DIY LED need help + input please

[bigdeeezy]

So I have been researching, reading and doing a lot of thinking and I want to do a DIY LED for my 75g (48x20x18) tank. I cant seem to figure out what I want and what I need to make it an effective and nice looking (color wise) fixture. I was thinking about purchasing the RapidLED DIY dimmable kit (http://www.rapidled.com/servlet/the-57/48-Ultra-Premium-LED/Detail) along with 2 of their 5.9"x16" heatsinks. What configuration of LEDs would I need to get in order for SPS to thrive and live on? Currently I have only LPS, softies and zoas under 2 250w halides and 2 110w VHO Actinics and now I would like to start growing SPS. I was talking to Robert about it and he gave me some insight on what ratio to get for my tank. Can you guys help me out and let me know what you think about this setup? I know I can use the dimmers to play around with the color I want, but I would like to maximize the brightness of all LEDs without the color being to white (would like it more blue).
Should I go 3/1 RB-CW or 50/50?
Is 48 LEDs overkill or good for my size tank?
How far up should it be mounted and which lenses should I use?
What configuration would be most efficient when mounting LEDs on heatsink?

Any help would be greatly appreciated. TIA

 

[rygh]

The problem is that what nice looking color means varies so much from person to person.
My opinion would be to go with 2 RB for each 1 CW, and make sure they are wired on
different drivers so you can tweak the color independently.

I have 140 LEDs on my 250G tank, which was overkill, and I had to turn it down quite a bit.
Still: If expense is not critical, better to go a bit overkill.
1) Much easier to turn the drivers down than to add more LEDs.
2) It allows for a more even light spread.
3) The LEDs last longer if under-driven, plus you can increase it over the years as they dim slightly.

My build thread is here : http://www.bareefers.org/home/node/11490

But despite all the time spent on different color LEDs and so on, I am really not completely happy with my LED system.
I love the low power, low heat, and total control.
But my SPS is not "thriving". (LPS/softies are though)
And while the color is pretty good, I am pretty picky, and think it could be better.

 

[bmhair03]

I'm currently running that setup over a 57gal. I went with a 2-1 ratio of RB to White. I'm currently using the 80 degree lenses. 60's were to spotlighted at my mounted height of 8" off the water. This too is my first try at SPS . After a lot of trial and errors I think I found the sweet spot starting to see some real growth . Good luck.

 

[sfsuphysics]

First if you want to maximize brightness don't even bother with the dimmable drivers and just get the non-dimmable ones and save I think about $20 each. Unless you have a way to electronically dim, I don't really feel like it's a worth wild investment.

Next to the colors, while that is completely subjective, a 50/50 blend would be too white, 3/1 would be much better, although I go 1 extra step and do 4/1 and its really not as blue as you'd think. Don't ask for a picture though, cameras won't do any setup justice. Also if you're not going to go 50/50 do NOT get that kit, since the CW LEDs are a buck more each and that is reflected in the price. Also the coloring is going to depend upon how close they are to one another as well as the arrangement.

As to the amount of LEDs, I like to point out to people that you really don't have any reason to illuminate every square inch of your tank with the same amount of light. Even so the heatsinks you mentioned means you'll get a 6" strip of brightness that expands outwards. Personally I'd make note of where your rocks/corals are/will be and see if you can't take advantage of that with where to place heatsinks.

If it were me I'd get maybe 10 & 10 LEDs and a driver, then make little setups of 1-1 2-1 3-1 5-2 etc to see which ones you like best as far as color, and then order the rest later. You can attach them to a piece of steel/aluminum (or hell buy a heatsink for $6) as you won't run them all day, you just want to get a feel of their color.

 

[sfsuphysics]

3) The LEDs last longer if under-driven, plus you can increase it over the years as they dim slightly.

The problem is that they're all spec'd at 350mA.

And NOBODY is driving them at that current, so its not so much as being under-driven, but being less over-driven

 

[rygh]

3) The LEDs last longer if under-driven, plus you can increase it over the years as they dim slightly.

The problem is that they're all spec'd at 350mA.

And NOBODY is driving them at that current, so its not so much as being under-driven, but being less over-driven

Very true.
But the longevity difference still applies. Just the absolute number and scale is different.

 

[rygh]

Addendum:
The choice of the LED ratio also depends a lot on your drive strength.
Driving RB at 700, and CW at 1050, is different from driving both at 700/700.
And changing that can save a fair bit of money on LEDs.
I ended up with 700/1200.

I agree with Mike: Buy a small setup, not the big package, and play around with different configurations.
As you can see, you already have completely different opinions on the amount of blue.
Normal.

 

[sfsuphysics]

True, I should say my 4-1 ratio I like my CW is at 1050mA

And yes don't forget to wire the colors up separately, even if you don't do dimming, you will want times when you have nothing but royal blue LEDs on (akin to actinics), as the color popping will make your jaw drop.

 

[bigdeeezy]

If it were me I'd get maybe 10 & 10 LEDs and a driver, then make little setups of 1-1 2-1 3-1 5-2 etc to see which ones you like best as far as color, and then order the rest later. You can attach them to a piece of steel/aluminum (or hell buy a heatsink for $6) as you won't run them all day, you just want to get a feel of their color.

I actually never thought about that! Great idea Mike! I really appreciate everyone's input...
Mike how is your LEDs set up on your heatsink? Clustered or spaced?

 

[bigdeeezy]

I'm currently running that setup over a 57gal. I went with a 2-1 ratio of RB to White. I'm currently using the 80 degree lenses. 60's were to spotlighted at my mounted height of 8" off the water. This too is my first try at SPS . After a lot of trial and errors I think I found the sweet spot starting to see some real growth . Good luck.

Brian - DO you have any pictures of how your fixture looks like and how it looks like on your tank? Just want to get an idea...

 

[sfsuphysics]

Mike how is your LEDs set up on your heatsink? Clustered or spaced?

Well I have two setups, my first was a 6 x 6 heatsink, and I have that with 9 LEDs spaced fairly evenly, that is 5 RB and 4CW 700/1050 mix, and I don't like the color at all, it's way too white. The other ones that I've been making are on I think 4x4 heatsinks, and those I have clustered close to the center 4Rb 1CW 700/1050 mix, which is probably as bad as you can get for thermal management since all the heat will be concentrated, but I think they're fine without a fan on them. The clustered ones though I can say I did want spot lights, basically wanted to lit particular parts of the tank, where certain corals were, and not much else, 40° optics are on them too.

 

[bigdeeezy]

Mike how is your LEDs set up on your heatsink? Clustered or spaced?

Well I have two setups, my first was a 6 x 6 heatsink, and I have that with 9 LEDs spaced fairly evenly, that is 5 RB and 4CW 700/1050 mix, and I don't like the color at all, it's way too white. The other ones that I've been making are on I think 4x4 heatsinks, and those I have clustered close to the center 4Rb 1CW 700/1050 mix, which is probably as bad as you can get for thermal management since all the heat will be concentrated, but I think they're fine without a fan on them. The clustered ones though I can say I did want spot lights, basically wanted to lit particular parts of the tank, where certain corals were, and not much else, 40° optics are on them too.

do you have a build thread? or any pics of your setup? I want to get a visual of how you did it. After looking at the Aqua Illuminations modules on Roberts tank, I was thinking about clustering them up in 3s to see how they look...I would love the AI SOLs but i dont have 800 to spend on 2 modules like that. lol

 

[sfsuphysics]

Yeah those AI units are kind of nice, not super pleased about the linearity of the fixture but there has to be that level occasionally. You could probably build a similar output device for maybe half the cost but no where near as pretty If you're going to do one unit, I'd say don't bother building, 2 units it becomes a little more tricky of an argument, if you don't even have lights for the tank the price makes a lot more sense, however swapping from existing lights to LEDs makes it hard to justify the cost of some of these fixtures at $400-750 a pop unless you just don't want to bother, or hell might have money to burn.

Don't think I have a build thread anywhere, here's a pic of one I'm currently putting together, biggest issue I've found is figuring out the best way to mount these suckers. Some of the solder joints are a little messy, its flux not burnt These are a for a frag tank though so blues and whites are all connected, I have no interest to independently turn them on/off.

 

[mmakay]

I have 96 Luxeon Rebels over a 48 x 24 x 24. (RB/B/NW) You can see pictures of my DIY in my Flickr album. A lot of the details are in the photo captions, but I'll happily answer questions.

 

[bigdeeezy]

I have 96 Luxeon Rebels over a 48 x 24 x 24. (RB/B/NW) You can see pictures of my DIY in my Flickr album. A lot of the details are in the photo captions, but I'll happily answer questions.

what optics are you running? Do you have a full tank shot with lighting on? Your setup looks complicated with circuit boards and what not...looks good

 

[sfsuphysics]

Just thinking, another option you might want to consider is just getting a couple of the Kessil fixtures, for a smaller tank like yours you could easily get away with 2 fixtures, and at around $260 each wouldn't be too hard on the wallet considering you're willing to spend $400 for stuff you need to put together yourself. Granted the Kessils are not dimmable nor can you get "blue only" but a couple stunner strips and you can get your evening "pop" if you like.

I know the club has a few of the Kessils that were donated to it, not sure what color spectrum they were given (or who actually has them now ) but maybe someone can bring them to a meeting and you can see what they do for yourself.

 

[mmakay]

what optics are you running? Do you have a full tank shot with lighting on? Your setup looks complicated with circuit boards and what not...looks good

They are Carclo 3-up optics. Wide ~ 80deg Where I bought them.

Actually, I don't have a recent picture of the tank, but I'll make it a point to do that in the next day or two.


-Mickey

 

[bmhair03]

I'm currently running that setup over a 57gal. I went with a 2-1 ratio of RB to White. I'm currently using the 80 degree lenses. 60's were to spotlighted at my mounted height of 8" off the water. This too is my first try at SPS . After a lot of trial and errors I think I found the sweet spot starting to see some real growth . Good luck.

Brian - DO you have any pictures of how your fixture looks like and how it looks like on your tank? Just want to get an idea...

Yes heres a link.
http://www.bareefers.org/home/node/9654?page=1

Sorry I didn't get into spec's. I'm in agreement with Mike about not try to light it as if it was a MH. My Heatsink is only 6" wide and so close to the surface of the water that
I don't get full spread of the tank. Could have raised my fixture but wife didn't want any higher. But the lower par levels around the edges gave me places for my LPS,etc. My light fixture is centered on the mid to upper rock work . 750/1050 ma seems to be the magic # 's for drivers.
Like both Mike and Mark stated there is a lot of personal preference and trial and error involved in color,spread,etc.
So I also suggest that if you go DIY that you start small and find what works for you and then go full scale.
Rapid LED is in the Bay Area and Mike that runs it is very helpful. I changed ratio on my kits when I ordered and he was awesome. Even saved shipping (and waiting)by p/u myself.
He has some really nice heatsinks coming out soon so check out his web site again soon.

 

[yardartist]

I have been hesitant to jump in here because I knew so little about my own build. I completed most of the hands on work but do not fully understand the electric or computer components. As you see in the photos I am using the Reef Angel controller, and Roberto has been great at getting my system programmed for three light circuits. There are two drivers with 7RB and 5WH LED each and one driver with 6RB, 2LightB, 2Red, and 1UV. On that one I have the two red taped off on the plexi sheild to limit the light going into the aquarium. The UV also has some sharpie on the plexi under it to limit its light.

Due to coral color, I think the RB/WH are still on too high. The RB/WH are at 60% and the Bl/Rd are at 40%. Undata and an acro are browned out. Green slimer, setosa, purple encrusting monti, and all LPS are good color. I raised the LED recently by about four inches more than the pill bottles they were resting on to help with the overexposure. They are at 9" above the water. Planning to bring down the % to all at 40%. The RB/WH are on about 6 hours a day and the Bl/Rd are on about ten. They give a great actinic effect.

I agree with everyone here that less units on small heat sink gives much better flexibility. Mine is 8"x17" with 35 stars. That is the one thing I would change. It is one large unit that would function better over a three feet square aquarium or other beast size for a 'spot' light. I would go for 5" square heat sinks at most.

http://s870.photobucket.com/albums/ab269/yardartist/LED/
http://s870.photobucket.com/albums/ab269/yardartist/Tank%20shots%20August%205%202011/