got ethical husbandry?

Dbtc thoughts, comments and issues

Has anyone ever used the dbtc or know someone who actually used it to go back find the corals they offered in the chains and ask for a frag back ? That is if that chain didn’t crash and burn or same coral different chain?
Like after a coral wipe out due equipment failures/leaks/ chemicals/bacteria power outages ..etc
When Ive seen incidents on here this amazing club automatically just offers up corals/ equipment/ tanks/ free labor!!! Etc ..to the club member who had the issue!
Just wondering
 
richiev said:
I was trying to avoid rabbit hole'ing too far, but now that the thread is renamed: for me the main issue with DBTC is it's not about the coral and propagation, it's about the individual. "This is my chain, I control how these corals are used in perpetuity until you meet my criteria, even recursively for future frags". To me the purest version is PIFs where it'd be wonderful if you could see how other people's are growing and how they were later distributed, even without special conditions on what you give out.

I don't think unconstrained giveaways (PIF) are in conflict with constrained ones (current DBTC) though. Not to go too computer nerdy, but it's all trees and sub-trees.

View attachment 62489

The top of this tree is the coral (#0). Some people give away that coral with no conditions (#2), others might give away with conditions (eg #1). They're all the same coral. Ideally the setup is oriented then around the coral and within it you can see info about it. Here's what this coral looks like in tank A vs B, and growth over time. Oh and btw personX has said in the past they can give it away free, while personY wants $10, and personZ gives it free but requires you to name your first child after them.
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The originator does not control who gets frags that others in later generations are giving out. They can use the default DBTC rules or make changes to the rules upfront. People who like those rules can participate. A couple years ago we discussed and decided that subsequent generations should follow the original rules, as much as possible.

We had a situation where an originator wasn’t happy with who was given frags in the second generation, both who was picked and the fact that they didn’t think they met their specific rules. That’s when we decided that the person who grew up and now is giving the coral in the next generation (not the originator) decides who it goes to, but should try to follow the original rules as best they can. The extra friction of this controversy is one of the reasons I don’t like specific rules and it also had the unfortunate effect that that generous originator took a break from DBTC.
 
Having conditions can be completely valid. If it's a higher end coral and the person's purpose for putting it on DBTC is to bank it, they shouldn't feel any pressure to just give it first come first served. At the same time, a requester should not feel entitled. Especially if they don't have much BAR history, don't have much reputation of success, lack of tank journal to show a viable setup.

I like to believe that most people receiving corals have the best intention of growing it and continuing the chain. Unfortunately that's not the case because of mortality rates and the time it takes to grow a frag into a size that's ready to frag again. Hah after 2 years I'm finally ready to frag @SupraSaltyReefer 's koji wada nepthea and continue the chain.
 
Srt4eric said:
One of the main reasons I started my frag system was for dbtc. Fragging out of my display for some of the dbtc corals wasn't really feasible.
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I definitely want to start up my AIO cube for a DBTC/frag system in the near future, but I need to get some good growth and get past the uglies stage before she will give me the green light. I explained the uglies stage to her before hand, but I dont think she fully understood it :p
 
CaseyP said:
Hah after 2 years I'm finally ready to frag @SupraSaltyReefer 's koji wada nepthea and continue the chain.
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I forgot I even gave you one. 2 years?! So slow man. I think your system is toooo clean lol. Glad it's ready to be fragged and put back in the DBTC.
I've been using frags of it to incentivize reefers to do things that will benefit the hobby (Help reopen Hawaii aquarium fishery) or if the person buying something from me is a BAR member I ask them if they want to be apart of DBTC and give it to them because it's convenient. Most people that request frags never message me and aren't willing to drive out to the farrrrr east bay for pick up ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
PjFish said:
Has anyone ever used the dbtc or know someone who actually used it to go back find the corals they offered in the chains and ask for a frag back ? That is if that chain didn’t crash and burn or same coral different chain?
Like after a coral wipe out due equipment failures/leaks/ chemicals/bacteria power outages ..etc
When Ive seen incidents on here this amazing club automatically just offers up corals/ equipment/ tanks/ free labor!!! Etc ..to the club member who had the issue!
Just wondering
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Yes I have gotten things back multiple times
 
DaddyHook said:
Another point to discuss. Should retail vendors be able to join a DBTC?
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I don't have a problem with it, especially if they are hobbyist at heart and also support the club. I mean frankly no different than someone doing a dbtc completing the chain than selling frags of it after that. It may actually be helpful as they have more systems, more experience and prehaps a higher chance at successful propagation based on experience and stable systems.

On a different note if they never supported the club and soley got involved only to get something for resale, I would be opposed to it. I would expect the BOD would be the first to address that if the later became a issue. This wouldn't be anything I think that warrants rules or addressing unless it becomes a issue.
 
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DaddyHook said:
Another point to discuss. Should retail vendors be able to join a DBTC?
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I never thought about this angle before, but I’d say its fine. They have experience, and you can see their experience/skills in person, easier to judge if they would be a good bank ( and I would guess probably one of the better/best banks)
 
Fish Boss said:
Just wanted to throw it out there, picked up some rainbow polyps at the swap, they were/are pretty tiny, but they look like the green center yellow/orange center line overall purple clove polyps. They are growing pretty fast, started with 2-3 polyps, already up to 7 polyps. Looks like maybe 3 active chains for this coral at the moment. I was thinking about starting a dbtc for it soon, probably 4-6 weeks. My thoughts are:

Pros: DBTC, easier access for some members that might be around me, since I’m on the outer vicinity of the club territory.

Cons: adding more filler DBTCs that people might not be interested in and could become DOA
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No takers? @Reefer Madness you are kind of close to me, want a frag in the near future?
 
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